Author Topic: Bigot Brother?  (Read 7520 times)

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Offline Luminar

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Bigot Brother?
« on: January 20, 2007, 04:30:52 am »
Now, im not normally one to watch TV at all, much less horrible reality TV shows, but this matter caught my attention.

Summary: Some chick from india is one of the participants, and a bunch of them are spewing racist bile at her and giving her a hard time of it.

India (yep, the country) is justifiably pissed off, as am I. This, IMO, is one of the bigger problems with England - the place is choc-a-bloc with this kind of crap, and it's entirely unreasonable. So what their skin's a bit darker and they have an accent? For a start, it doesn't make them worse in any way and second they didn't choose to be like that, not that they should choose for the sake of other people. Any and all racism should frankly be illegal to say or do. Judge by deeds and choices, not circumstances beyond their control is what I say.

Either way, this crap is getting broadcast on tv (if certain words are getting beeped out) and the station is getting complaints like crazy. The other contestants in question are using slurs against indians, telling her to "go home", refusing to eat any food touched by her, and just generally making total nobs of themselves. In all honesty, they should call this series off if this is going to become a danger to the lass's health or dignity, or if it's manageable, evict and/or replace the racists.



Offline Mr. Consideration

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2007, 04:41:08 am »
It's all gone a little overboard, in my opinion. Burning Effigies of Jade Goody, I mean, It's like when she won! A complaint not just from the people, but from the state! It's been on the front page of every (crappy) newspaper.

I think they should have evicted Jade for her racism instantly, and been over with it. Then they could have apologised, not lost millions, and not be hated by Indians everywhere.

Our country is irritatingly racist, and it annoys me immensley. The whole "Indians come over and steal our jobs." thing annoys me so much, How about "Indians-come-over-and-earn-our-jobs-because-they-aren't-white-trash-and-have-a-very-strong-work-ethic?". I don't know many Indians, but I know a few Bangladeshi's and get on well with them.

I am yet to meet an educated Racist.
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Offline Krakow Sam

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2007, 08:23:50 am »
Lets hope this incident ruins Goody's 'career' such as it is.

It pisses me off when people claim immigrants steal their jobs too. Its just rampant scapegoating by Daily Sport reading spongers with 22 kids by 23 different partners who would rather drink White Lightning and watch daytime TV than earn a living cleaning toilets or sweeping streets. Those being the only jobs theyre qualified for because instead of going to school they were throwing bins through shop-windows and having underage sex with other drop-outs.

In conclusion... ummm... what were we talking about again?
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Offline Luminar

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2007, 09:33:42 am »
There ARE spongers that come here just to get the money for being immigrants, yes - but it's not all of them. That's where they truly can't win - if they're seen outside of work, they're the leechers. If they're seen in work, they're job thieves.

I actually never understood the whole "job stealing" thing. If they're good enough at doing whatever they're doing, surely they're entitled to have the job?

Offline Tesla

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2007, 10:53:06 am »
I wholesomely agree, Ireland is filling up with Polish people, who are very good at their jobs. We had our attic converted by them and unlike Irish workers, who work slowly and demand lunch breaks every 2 hours, they work until the wee hours of the night (or whenever you tell them to stop) with no breaks!
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Offline Serdun

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2007, 05:24:29 pm »
So wait, why are you against freedom of speech, Luminar?  :-\
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Offline Krakow Sam

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2007, 05:46:14 pm »
What about Freedom of not being called racist names by trailer trash?
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Offline Serdun

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2007, 06:27:29 pm »
The whole idea of freedom of speech is that people are allowed to say what they believe. One is free to disagree with it- I hate racism, and think it is a serious problem Western culture must solve- but not solve by passing laws limiting thought and opinion. Racist actions, however, are quite another thing entirely- I fully support punishments for racial discrimination and hate crimes. However, I also believe that for a country to be truly free, its citizens should be able to decide and voice their own opinions, no matter how twisted they may be.
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Offline Cobra

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2007, 09:08:25 pm »
They should be aloud to say what they wont but they should know that with being a dick and being racist comes consequences such as if you are a celeb and you are like that it will hurt your career.

Offline Daxx

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2007, 09:53:59 pm »
With freedom of speech comes responsibiliity for what you say. You are free to call someone a baby-eater, but be prepared to be sued for slander. Calling someone something offensive to their face is likely to get yours punched in. You have to accept the consequences of your speech and take responsibility for them. Freedom of speech is too often abused as something to hide behind so that a person doesn't have to deal with the consequences of what they say.

One hopes that this doesn't tarnish the British reputation for inclusiveness and multiculturalism. One idiot saying something on TV should not reflect on an entire nation, especially not an idiotic and uneducated z-list "celebrity" like Jade Goody.

Offline Luminar

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2007, 02:22:25 am »
Freedom of speech only applies to the government not kicking you in for saying what they don't like. Mr. Thug of 22 Rottweiler Lane, however, will be quite happy to bash your lights out if you called his dear old mother anything.

And for that reason, that's why freedom of speech isn't freedom at all. Unlike many think, it is neither a pillar of human progress nor the ultimate aegis to hide behind. So rather than angrily asking me why i'm against freedom of speech, ask yourself why your right to be openly racist is a thing you want to defend. Note that I am not calling you as such, but that is what your argument equates to.

Offline Serdun

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2007, 10:32:08 am »
If "Mr. Thug" bashed my lights out, he'd be charged with assault. I don't understand why you say:
Freedom of speech isn't freedom at all.

Oh, and Krakow, that's when you'd get a restraining order.  ;)
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Offline Krakow Sam

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2007, 11:07:50 am »
The British justice system doesnt operate in a way that allows you to exploit it to settle petty disputes... plus, why get lawyers involved?
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Offline syphonbyte

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #13 on: January 22, 2007, 06:31:22 pm »
One hopes that this doesn't tarnish the British reputation for inclusiveness and multiculturalism.

That was sarcasm, right?

Offline 762

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #14 on: January 22, 2007, 06:39:32 pm »
The British are about as inclusive and multicultural as the Germans. I'm not saying that's a bad thing or a good thing, it's just a thing.

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Offline Manna

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #15 on: January 22, 2007, 08:30:00 pm »
The British are about as inclusive and multicultural as the Germans. I'm not saying that's a bad thing or a good thing, it's just a thing.

You do know they dont still line up in red coats and fire muskets at people, dont you? The thing about history is that it's a thing of the past. Saying that the Brittish are against multiculturalism because Jade Goody made some comments on TV is about as reliable as saying all Americans hate jews because Mel Gibson said some nasty stuff while drunk. Show me some kind of evidence that the country in question is elitist and dont just follow the daily newspaper's oppinion on the world.

Just to quell any future arguments, I am a republican and would very much like to drop all ties to "mother england" from my country. This argument is not some kind of international patriotism.
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Offline Mr. Consideration

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2007, 10:54:21 am »
It annoys me that most Americans stereotypes of British people involve "Tally-ho!" Top hats, and Tea. While our Stereotypes of a fat, gun-ho American are widley incorrect, ours are at least not a hundred years out of date.
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Offline Krakow Sam

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2007, 11:28:58 am »
The British are about as inclusive and multicultural as the Germans. I'm not saying that's a bad thing or a good thing, it's just a thing.

Quote from: Wikipedia
he United Nations Population Fund lists Germany as hosting the third-highest percentage of international migrants worldwide

Put that in your pipe and smoke it  :P

also:

Quote from: Wikipedia
As of 2001, 13.1% of the UK's population identified themselves as an ethnic minority. The United Kingdom has amongst the highest immigration rates in Europe

I know being an immigrant isnt quite the same as multiculturalism, but have any of you ever been to London?

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Offline 762

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2007, 11:41:14 am »
The British are about as inclusive and multicultural as the Germans. I'm not saying that's a bad thing or a good thing, it's just a thing.

You do know they dont still line up in red coats and fire muskets at people, dont you? The thing about history is that it's a thing of the past. Saying that the Brittish are against multiculturalism because Jade Goody made some comments on TV is about as reliable as saying all Americans hate jews because Mel Gibson said some nasty stuff while drunk. Show me some kind of evidence that the country in question is elitist and dont just follow the daily newspaper's oppinion on the world.

Just to quell any future arguments, I am a republican and would very much like to drop all ties to "mother england" from my country. This argument is not some kind of international patriotism.

I'm not basing my claim on the fact that one chick said that, I'm basing it on the fact that Brits do not have a ton of foreign blood mixed with them, at least compared to America. They don't persecute or hate, they're just not multicultural.

You do know they dont still line up in red coats and fire muskets at people, dont you?
How did you get that out of what I said?

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Offline LadyM

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #19 on: January 23, 2007, 12:33:48 pm »
Quote from: Wikipedia
As of 2001, 13.1% of the UK's population identified themselves as an ethnic minority. The United Kingdom has amongst the highest immigration rates in Europe

I know being an immigrant isnt quite the same as multiculturalism, but have any of you ever been to London?

Yes and I quite enjoyed it.  :)

Offline Daxx

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #20 on: January 23, 2007, 12:47:52 pm »
I'm not basing my claim on the fact that one chick said that, I'm basing it on the fact that Brits do not have a ton of foreign blood mixed with them, at least compared to America. They don't persecute or hate, they're just not multicultural.

Well, 13 percent identified with being in an ethnic minority. That doesn't include people who identify as English even though their ancestry is foreign. There are similar large percentages for religion which I looked up earlier on the wiki but didn't post. We're perhaps one of the more multicultural nations on the planet. We have a crapload of immigration, moreso than a lot of other countries.

America itself doesn't really count, largely because it's either in the hick states in the middle where everyone is white or the coastal states who have large amounts of immigrants (and America being a nation which one could technically claim is almost entirely comprised of immigrants is somewhat different to most other countries in the world).

Multiculturalism and tolerance (and political correctness *spits*) are large parts of public policy.

Offline Krakow Sam

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #21 on: January 23, 2007, 12:51:02 pm »
Brits do not have a ton of foreign blood mixed with them.
Just Saxon, Norse, French, Celtic and Roman.

Its also telling that curry is one of the most popular types of food here. As are Kebabs, and chinese.
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Offline 762

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #22 on: January 23, 2007, 12:59:11 pm »
My point is that Brits mainly look different from French look different from Spanish from Germans from Russians etc. Europe is a relatively small place to have so many different ethnicities and sub-races. There is an English ethnicity, that is what I am getting at. I can't even articulate my point.

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Offline Krakow Sam

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #23 on: January 23, 2007, 01:37:05 pm »
Europe is small now?

 ???
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Offline 762

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #24 on: January 23, 2007, 01:43:03 pm »
That wasn't my whole sentence. Europe is a relatively small place to have so many distinct ethnic groups.

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Offline /lurk

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #25 on: January 23, 2007, 02:12:19 pm »
The Middle East isn't that big.
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Offline Samog

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #26 on: January 23, 2007, 02:34:22 pm »
The British may not be particularly inclusive and multicultural, but you guys do have quite a reputation for being so.
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Offline Interitus

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #27 on: January 24, 2007, 03:45:45 am »
Yay I get such a unique view in this. Being half Indian and half scottish living in Canada the last 20 years of my life.

I've heard all sides of racism, when a white person talks to me they seem to forget I am half Indian or vice versa. (like the Canadian women who I had known for years who said she hates all immigrants. When I pointed out I was an immigrant I "don't count".)

I find that racism is very complex. In the UK many of my Indian relatives are actually very mis-trustful of black people. Where as my white English aunt has a black boyfriend.

Overall though I'd say the UK is quite tolerant. As one of the main colonial powers they are no stranger to people of other cultures. Considering the amount of various cultures put on this small island, I'd say they are doing fairly well for themselves.   If anything I'd say racism is more of a behind closed doors thing. People might hold prejudice or even hatred, but it's not often expressed in public.

As for the big brother thing, I've been following that since I got here. I found most of Jade's comments more bullying or ignorant then racist. That hardly is an excuse though, and doesn't excuse the actions and comments that were made that did seem more provoked by Shilpa's race.

I was impressed by the British public by the volume of complaints that came in. It's obvious Channel 4 did very little to stop them, and only after the flood of complaints they tried stopping Jade. (calling her into the diary room and repeating back to her comments she had said). How this ends up though remains to be seen.

Will Big Brother ratings drop? If so, is it because people are refusing to watch the show for doing nothing or is it because controversay makes for better ratings?

If any good came out of all this I'd say it hopefully has more people stepping back and looking at themselves and seeing if they do stereotype people. And how they can better themselves.

*It should be noted that the Indian part of my family lived in Africa before moving to the UK. They were forced out of Africa by a change in government which might be the root of their mis-trust of black people.
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Offline Krakow Sam

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #28 on: January 24, 2007, 06:59:42 am »
I've heard all sides of racism, when a white person talks to me they seem to forget I am half Indian or vice versa. (like the Canadian women who I had known for years who said she hates all immigrants. When I pointed out I was an immigrant I "don't count".)

Heh heh. I had a similar experience to that. I took it to mean the person I was talking to didnt actually hate immigrants at all, it was just a sort of irrational fear of the unknown.
The point is that there are good people and bastards in every group, and if you only go by how the bastards act then you arent going to get a clear picture of that group as a whole.
Sam is basically right, he's just cranky.

Offline 762

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #29 on: January 24, 2007, 12:27:30 pm »
The point is that there are good people and bastards in every group, and if you only go by how the bastards act then you arent going to get a clear picture of that group as a whole.

I agree. I don't know if I didn't express my point or what, but I'm afraid I may have sounded like a wanker.

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Offline Interitus

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #30 on: January 24, 2007, 01:03:02 pm »
-snip-

Another one was when I lived in an extremely white community, I was one of the extremely few people of colour at the time. I went to school with a kid who was a metis (one parent was aboriginal). He often used to talk to me about being a minority and sticking up for one another (strangely though I was never bullied due to race). Anyway when I told him I was moving to Vancouver he was shocked because it was full of "them". When I asked who "them" were he replied the chinese.  I guess they don't count as a minority in his books. Needless to say I haven't spoken with him since.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2007, 01:02:19 pm by Interitus »
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Offline Bastardman

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #31 on: January 28, 2007, 07:53:48 am »
I really don't think I could care less about this.

Big Brother was already the biggest train wreck on television. If this results in the show being pulled, all the better.

Offline Luminar

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #32 on: January 28, 2007, 11:21:53 am »
Agreed, but.

It shows you how much your statement is true that broadcasted racism is what they sank to in order to try and pull some attention to the damn show.

Offline Tesla

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #33 on: January 28, 2007, 01:20:46 pm »
It's kind of funny. This is great publicity for the Indian girl (her name escapes me right now...) and terrible for Jane Goody. I am actually seeing the girls movies pop up now, and now everyone knows her name and feels sorry for her.

It's also weird because Jane Goody is a useless chav who is only a "star2 because she won Big Brother a few years ago, while the other girl has a load of money and is a Bollywood star.
No way dude, you're trolling me.

Offline Cobra

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #34 on: January 28, 2007, 09:00:40 pm »
I really don't think I could care less about this.

Big Brother was already the biggest train wreck on television. If this results in the show being pulled, all the better.

If a guy hitting a girl in the face with his privates (Turkey Slapping as it quickly became well known as) on Australian Big Brother didn't get that pulled, a racist bigot comment wont get the Pom English one pulled.

Offline Manna

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #35 on: January 29, 2007, 02:02:41 am »
Big Brother thrives on controversy. Every time something like this happens people become interested and the show pulls more ratings. One day it'll go too far but for now, every time we become outraged and annoyed by it we're helping them.

Any publicity is good publicity.
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Offline Interitus

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Re: Bigot Brother?
« Reply #36 on: January 29, 2007, 01:06:05 pm »
You know what though, I'm no fan of big brother, but I say if all this caused racism and different forms of it to be brought back to light, then good. Sure big brother might have absolutely no soul and love the attention it's getting. But if it caused even one person to reconsider how they think of a group of people or act around them.. well you can't say the result is bad, even if the means are questionable.
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