Author Topic: Monkeys with guns  (Read 10419 times)

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Offline Therewolf

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Monkeys with guns
« on: July 26, 2006, 01:36:20 pm »
I've checked and seen this in a few threads, but there aren't any threads about this directly,
Basically I am wondering how technologically advance you get in the tribal stage, more specifically can you make guns in the tribal stage?
and can your ceatures continue to use their bio-weapons in the tribal stage?
I doubt this has been confirmed, but I think it would be interesting.



Offline Daxx

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2006, 01:46:51 pm »
Unfortunately, at this stage we just don't know. However, it's probably safe to guess that the monkeys won't have guns until the later stages.

Offline Mjavabean

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2006, 02:18:59 pm »
I hope there will be a 'tech tree', you need to have a ranged weapon and gunpowder research to get guns, for example.

Offline mccarty181

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2006, 03:04:50 pm »
but then it becomes much like an RTS in that satge im not saying it would be bad but some people would
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Offline Zellman

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2006, 06:15:17 pm »
I would guess that your race moves into the civilization phase as soon as their society reaches a more organized level.  which in my guess would be around the human Greece, or Rome.
But who really knows at this point.  they may even be hashing that out right now.

Offline Uroboros

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2006, 09:13:49 pm »
I hope there will be a 'tech tree', you need to have a ranged weapon and gunpowder research to get guns, for example.
I hope we dont have a concrete tech tree. In my experience, nothing sucks more than a "complete freedom of research and design" game, where you are just given a tech tree, and then vehicles with 2 or 3 interchangable parts.

TheNecromonicon

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2006, 09:19:19 pm »
I'd like to have the freedom to create electricity before fire, gun powder before bows and arrows, and computers before paper.

Offline shadowlord18

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2006, 10:21:45 pm »
i think what will happen is when you come to the civilision stage of the game then mabey you will guns but i think the tanks we saw maybe better than some beast with pistol i think as to the point of tech trees is that some things must knowen before you can say make gunpowder or computers
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Offline Brutus

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2006, 04:38:48 am »
i have always wanted to see if there will be bows and throwing spears in tribal stage
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Offline gbCerberus

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2006, 11:44:39 am »
I'd like to have the freedom to create electricity before fire, gun powder before bows and arrows, and computers before paper.
How do you propose they forge the metal wiring for a electrical cord without knowledge of fire?
Guns are part of an arms race stretching back thousands of years, starting with sticks and rocks. Not only are they pretty sophisticated, but they are the result of your enemy having better weapons / defenses.

Try to think about what would happen if you were stranded on an uninhabited Earth-like planet. You were given very basic tools for survival, but nothing more. How do you go about building a transponder to signal an S.O.S. (or more to the point, a starship capable of taking you home)? It would take time and a lot of technological steps.

I'm not saying technology has to follow the pattern of what happened on Earth, that would suck in my opinion (I always found it odd in Civilization that Wonders of the World are used. It looks really, really weird to look at a city hosting the Great Pyramid of Egypt, the Roman Colosseum, and the Great Wall of China).

In my interpretation, I think Will was talking about giving smart animals tools that humans normally use. His example is guns, but from what we know of the Tribal stage... what if we could somehow give monkeys (or any other animal, like dogs) the ability to express itself through music or speech?


This reminds me of the first section of 2001: A Space Odyssey where the Monoliths attempted to kickstart intelligent life on our planet. Humans are just one of a dozen candidate species, and we succeed through luck - mostly because our bodies are so physically weak compared to other animals. When it comes down to it, the only real strength we have is our intelligence and the dexterity of our hands. Just maybe, Arthur C. Clarke hypothesizes, that is why we've been driven to create tools. Other animals are successful because they're built for surviving. We aren't, without our intelligence and tools we would be an evolutionary failure... but that failing (our lack of physical strength, body weaponry) has made us the technological civilization we are now.

In other words, it doesn't really make sense to me for a sinister race with claws and sharp teeth to one day decide to make up for something with technology (and build starships to harass the galaxy with); the species I make will be frail and pitiful.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2006, 12:03:20 pm by gbCerberus »
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TheNecromonicon

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2006, 12:13:17 pm »
The only thing that limits advancement is the limits we place on our imagination. Anything could be possible, even batteries before fire, or guns before swords. Free your mind Neo... free your mind.

Offline gbCerberus

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2006, 12:18:39 pm »
Ok then, how do you propose you'd go about doing it, if you were in the Paleolithic -- excuse me -- "Paleo-machina" Age?

How do you make a computer out of wood and animal bones? Where would the impetus come from? I'd be more worried about that predator eyeing my mate. "Oh look, a stick!"
« Last Edit: July 27, 2006, 12:22:52 pm by gbCerberus »
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TheNecromonicon

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2006, 12:28:33 pm »
Ok then, how do you propose you'd go about doing it, if you were in the Paleolithic -- excuse me -- "Paleo-machina" Age?

How do you make a computer out of wood and animal bones? Where would the impetus come from? I'd be more worried about that predator eyeing my mate. "Oh look, a stick!"

Perhaps you have no predators. Perhaps the sapient creature on the planet is its top predator. Perhaps you have larger and more easily accessable amounts of higher metals on your planet than we have on earth.

Whatever, I'm tired of arguments as of late. You beleive what limited possiblities you will, and I will beleive mine.

Offline gbCerberus

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2006, 12:33:34 pm »
I was just talking about what would happen we gave dogs the ability to talk, yet I'm not being imaginative?

There's a difference between arguing and debating.
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Offline lolasan

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Re: monkeys with guns?
« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2006, 12:48:09 pm »
I'd like to have the freedom to create electricity before fire, gun powder before bows and arrows, and computers before paper.
How do you propose they forge the metal wiring for a electrical cord without knowledge of fire?
Guns are part of an arms race stretching back thousands of years, starting with sticks and rocks. Not only are they pretty sophisticated, but they are the result of your enemy having better weapons / defenses.

Try to think about what would happen if you were stranded on an uninhabited Earth-like planet. You were given very basic tools for survival, but nothing more. How do you go about building a transponder to signal an S.O.S. (or more to the point, a starship capable of taking you home)? It would take time and a lot of technological steps.

I'm not saying technology has to follow the pattern of what happened on Earth, that would suck in my opinion (I always found it odd in Civilization that Wonders of the World are used. It looks really, really weird to look at a city hosting the Great Pyramid of Egypt, the Roman Colosseum, and the Great Wall of China).

In my interpretation, I think Will was talking about giving smart animals tools that humans normally use. His example is guns, but from what we know of the Tribal stage... what if we could somehow give monkeys (or any other animal, like dogs) the ability to express itself through music or speech?

That's pretty much what I gathered, except two things about the electricity before fire.

First, Fire was already invented, it wasn't controlled.

Likewise, If fire was not controlled, how could we have ignited the gun powder.
And with this post, I've opened yet another can of worms.

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