Author Topic: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore  (Read 23178 times)

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Offline MisterBibs

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2008, 03:49:50 pm »
I've always been of the following opinion:

The early Spore videos were just that: very early. Everything was cobbled together. What we saw was the mechanics of the game, but none of the game itself.

What happened, though, was that people (like the OP) thought this was the game. The use of the term "Wild Spore" is a great term for it. People (like the OP) saw this open area and incorrectly thought that such a thing would be The Game.

But like Toddtest in Morrowind and Oblivion, those areas weren't The Game.

Offline Grangan

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #16 on: December 17, 2008, 06:06:25 pm »
I may have figured out the extent the overhype reached:
Look for the thread "Is spore going to be like The Matrix?"
Twas Brillig and the slithy toves did gyre and gimble in the wabe, all mimsy were the borogoves and the mome raths outgrabe.

Offline RR_Raptor65

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #17 on: December 17, 2008, 06:49:50 pm »
The problem Spore has is nothing you make matters.  If I stick a row of spikes down the side of my creature, other creatures can still run up and kick it around to their hearts content without getting hurt while doing so.
If you did that in Cell that meant you had an actual defense and predators would get injured if they tried to attack your armoured hide then decide you're not worth the trouble and swim off.
Same goes for everything else, it's all just a pretty avatar that makes no difference on how you play the game.

Take a game like Garry's Mod for example, you can build hundreds of more or less identical tanks, fight battles with them, then get a stroke of genius and come up with a new technology to increase their effectiveness based on what you want that creation to do.  In Spore's case, you might encounter a creature that you have to evolve to cope with.  Or like the tanks in WWII, you might need to modify your vehicles to counter what the enemy has to offer, same with spacecraft. 
And it's not like you'll be upset that you had to make some design changes because in the end you'll have a winning design you can be proud of in the game.

Offline Jaleho

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #18 on: December 17, 2008, 07:37:38 pm »
Maxis made the same mistake the public school system has -- solve the problem for the user so they are "always a winner!"

Case in point -- Asymmetry. Why was it removed? "It messed up some animations."

...

So?

What is so horrible about letting the PLAYER fix that? If an asymmetrical creature moves badly, the player has two choices:

1. KEEP the bad animation, and learn to love it.
     In the end, IT'S OUR CREATION! Maybe I *WANT* a creature to be off-balance, or have vehicle parts nailed to it. What is the reasoning for preventing us from doing that? "It's not realistic"? SO WHAT?! If I want to saw my Lego bricks in half, or glue pieces together, or mix them with clay, toothpicks, paperclips or GI Joe weapons, are the Lego guys going to show up and arrest me? Why then did Spore have to "protect us" from our own "mistakes". They pimped the game as being "our story, our creations" but in the end, they didn't trust us. They thought we'd disappoint OURSELVES, so they had to hold our hands.

2. Make changes so it doesn't animate badly.
     If something doesn't look right, why not let *US* fix it? Why are they so afraid of us breaking *their* game? They kept talking about "learning curves" and instead of helping the users, they just kept tossing features left and right. That's like giving a kid Legos, and when he can't make the pieces fit right, you file off the nubs so you just stack them like blocks. But then gravity kicks in and the blocks fall, and since we can't fix gravity, we glue all the pieces into the tower before giving it to the kid.

     Someone actually thought removing all the frustrations would make the game MORE fun.

So here's my little note to any developer still lurking about these forums:

You know how it's mentioned that Feature A made Feature B look bad, and that Feature C confused people?

EXPERIMENTATION
AND LEARNING
WAS
THE GAME


Thanks for killing that for us.

And we wonder why the school system is failing. God forbid people actually have to start figuring things our for ourselves and risk *gasp* not living in fairy tale land.

In the end, do you really believe all the things that were removed resulted in better creations (watch any of the top rated creatures try to walk -- they only look good standing still) or a more enjoyable gameplay (The first hour in space is no different than the last hour in space. And for a lot of people, they were the same hour)?

Go back and watch all your old videos. Dig up all the code from the earlier versions. Please, give us the game we saw grow and die before our eyes.

Or do the decent thing and sell the code to a company that WILL.

Offline Grangan

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #19 on: December 17, 2008, 07:44:43 pm »
That's mean.  :'(
Twas Brillig and the slithy toves did gyre and gimble in the wabe, all mimsy were the borogoves and the mome raths outgrabe.

Offline Grazony

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #20 on: December 17, 2008, 08:14:07 pm »
No, that's the truth.

You'll never know why.
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Offline Blulightning

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #21 on: December 18, 2008, 03:10:00 am »
The second poster was correct - this proliferation of "Spore was a disappointment" threads is getting way out of hand... There should be one thread for this topic - not a thousand. 
Alternatively, it could be said the apologist threads are getting way out of hand. Depends on perspective, I guess.
Fumanchu:This is a spore fan forum.  We are supposed to be spore fans.

I think the problem here lies in the fact that everyone here are the Spore fans.... and most people are still really disappointed.

The problem Spore has is nothing you make matters.  If I stick a row of spikes down the side of my creature, other creatures can still run up and kick it around to their hearts content without getting hurt while doing so.
If you did that in Cell that meant you had an actual defense and predators would get injured if they tried to attack your armoured hide then decide you're not worth the trouble and swim off.
Same goes for everything else, it's all just a pretty avatar that makes no difference on how you play the game.

I think this sums up Spore. Nothing you make matters, and the only stage that actually simulated anything was the cell stage that lasts for about 3 minutes.
Everything afterwards was just a dumbed down game. It wasn't a sim. It didn't simulate anything.
It was just a series of editors that allowed you to move your avatars around on semi-pretty little planets.

It had no content. No gameplay. No Strategy. No concept.
Spore was a failure because the gameplay simply didn't exist or matter at all.

And that is why there are so many topics about why Spore didn't meet anyone's expectations.

Offline Jaleho

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #22 on: December 18, 2008, 10:08:40 am »
It was just a series of editors that allowed you to move your avatars around on semi-pretty little planets.

And in tribal and civ, you didn't even get to move them yourself...

Offline ProfPendragon

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #23 on: December 19, 2008, 09:02:46 pm »
Spore, IMHO, is a case study in compromises.

Back when I saw the more realistic amoeba evading the others in the early demos, I thought that was really neat.  Like, REALLY neat.  I thought the same thing when I saw the bloody fight on the beach. 

But upon reflection, was it really Maxis?  Those early demos were very cool, but they lacked the penache or sense of humor that Maxis always tried to put into everything.  Now, we have a game that tries-- often TOO hard-- to be whimsical, but now I and others are angry as well, perhaps irrationally, that it's also not the same thing we saw before. 

They had great visions for Spore, but they had to bring it down to Earth and keep it in line with their own traditions, and then they also had to bow to the larger machinations of EA.  Some of the compromises were forced, brought on by technology that just didn't quite pan out, and some were done for *shudder* marketing reasons. 

Would I love to see a game closer to the originals?  In a way, yes.  But I also hold out hope.  How many of us played Sims 2 and said, "Aw, this is great, but if they only had X"....?  A VAST number of EPs later, Sims 2 is as complex a game as many people could ask for, and it's still considered to be aimed at 'casual' players! 
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Offline AlfredO

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #24 on: December 20, 2008, 03:20:19 am »
My theory is that in this video there is another message: "emergent gameplay". We are promised to expect the unexpected. To be surprised everytime we play. Spore will be a wild place where whatever can happen. This is at least the message I received. Maybe it was my fault. But I think I'm not alone on this.
That's exactly why I don't like it as much as I thought I would. I wanted a little world where anything can happen, instead I get a theme park and a tour guide who has to come with me everywhere I go. Like a vacation to North Korea! Fun, fun, fun.

Offline ProfPendragon

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #25 on: December 20, 2008, 02:18:20 pm »
... instead I get a theme park and a tour guide who has to come with me everywhere I go. Like a vacation to North Korea! Fun, fun, fun.

... in Soviet Galaxy,  Spore evolve you!
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Offline Grangan

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #26 on: December 20, 2008, 02:46:33 pm »
...oh my God, I think you've started a trend.
In Soviet Galaxy, SecuRom complains about YOU!
Twas Brillig and the slithy toves did gyre and gimble in the wabe, all mimsy were the borogoves and the mome raths outgrabe.

Offline emmet

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #27 on: December 20, 2008, 02:59:07 pm »
Oldest internet joke EVAR.

Get with the times people! Throwing various things at bush is the new meme!
No way dude, you're trolling me.

Offline MisterBibs

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #28 on: December 20, 2008, 03:53:10 pm »
Can anyone who has stated their dislike for Spore tell me that I - and the millions of mainstream gamers in the world - should enjoy a game where I have to experiment and grind just to get my creature to work properly?

Offline Skyward

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Re: Wild Spore vs Domesticated Spore
« Reply #29 on: December 20, 2008, 04:55:05 pm »
why should people who dislike it, whom you just so happen to agree with, have to tell you to dislike it?
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