Topic: A statement to EA (Please read Maxis team, and send to your superiors)

[TDKenyon]

[Stuff about Maxis that isn't my point]

Now I am not Maxis but I can give you the most likely answers.

Firstly, as Tr0n nicely explained, the current sales numbers are by a majority are not from Spore fans but from casual players. It is in the hopes that Maxis can attract them first since their audience is larger. Once enough interest is garnered from them Maxis can focus on the hardcore.

[Nice, positive stuff that isn't my point]

QFT. QFT for Tr0n. QFT for Lucy. We got what they knew would make the most profitable Spore. Profit is also potential in Maxis's way of doing things. They have always left room for expansion (literally). They make franchises, not just games. They set up a base that has "so much potential," as everyone puts it, not to fail but to continue to succeed. Expansion after expansion, game after game. That's what we really want, isn't it? More games, more options, just... more. That's what gamers, real fans, are all about - generations of true, honest entertainment, not just one good game. If they didn't make Spore profitable, it would not have potential to continue to grow; we'd have gotten what we selfishly wanted, but we would have sacrificed years and years of new enjoyment.

[gec05]

The original Sims didn't really reach it's full potential until most of it's expansions were released.

[Arachoid]

I s'pose people just want what they were shown. Who'da thought, eh?

Even in the GDC '07 presentation, things were so much more... Fluid? Like, city building: You didn't have a set number of spaces, the walls just kinda shifted to where you needed. Same with tribal villages. I think people are so disappointed because these things were removed, after they were just shown. The Molyneux maneuver was pulled.

I'm not saying that EA is the villain here, and forced Maxis to cut content to save for expansions. It could've just as easily been technical. But the shallow cut-down toy we got was a sore disappointment, and I had mediocre expectations. People were wanting to do crazy things that no one else had thought of that would've been near impossible for the devs to implement. But after waiting for this thing since the sixth grade, I expected to at least be able to put campfires and huts wherever I wanted, not just a cookie-cutter template (as was demonstrated at GDC '05).

I also recall a post on the Sporum where a former Maxis intern, freed from his NDA, mentioned that creatures in early builds actually obeyed physics (to an extent), used their structural morphology to their advantage, and generally had a purpose as to the arrangement of their body. Now we have creatures that use the same parts simply because they give the best stat points.

By the same hand that we have a total lack of realism, it could be worse: Creatures could be forced into wearing Hecker brand sneakers. But I digress.

[Hydromancerx]

The original Sims didn't really reach it's full potential until most of it's expansions were released.

That's true. Also people really did not have any other game to compare it to. Everything was brand new for the Sims 1.

[Petike]

Spore fans are NOT like Sims fans, in many ways.  First, you lost most of the Sims fans at the word "Spore".  Second, Sims fans are largely disorganized.  If they dislike a business practice, they will keep it to themselves.  The ones who yell are not heard as none listen.  Spore fans on the other hand, are massively part of the internet generation. 

How do you know? This site, and other fansites only represent a minor part of the players. 2 million bought the game, and possibly many of them considers himself/herself a fan, without ever visiting these fansites, and telling their opinion.

[Lippy]

I can already see it:

Lion King: Hot Date   

Sleeping Beauty: Open for Business   

I s'pose people just want what they were shown. Who'da thought, eh?
Even in the GDC '07 presentation, things were so much more... Fluid? Like, city building: You didn't have a set number of spaces, the walls just kinda shifted to where you needed.

Soren Johnson, lead designer of Civilization 4 was brought in to help bring gameplay to the civ phase.  He changed that, making it so the building placement would have meaning.  Complaints about lack of gameplay or complaints that they add gameplay.  Maxis can't win.

I also recall a post on the Sporum where a former Maxis intern, freed from his NDA, mentioned that creatures in early builds actually obeyed physics (to an extent), used their structural morphology to their advantage, and generally had a purpose as to the arrangement of their body.

What the intern doesn't mention was that it failed to work on half the creatures, was slow, and very hard to tweak.   Chris Hecker, the one who gets all the blame from that intern for changing it, actually developed the physics based animation system he loved.  Chris knew from the start it wouldn't work with their game design based on creativity first, and gameplay second.  He also says that such a game based on the physics animation might be fun, but Spore wasn't it. 

What everyone wanted Spore to be is impossible without expansions.  They would not be able to make each phase a full game on the caliber of civilization, or diablo.  They were making each phase simple.  They couldn't make the game any other way.  They started out trying to make the game as simple as they could, and they still released 2 years later than their first estimated release date, and they still had to gut the game to make the Sep 08 release.  Expansions are necessary. 

[DarkPlasma]

That's true. Also people really did not have any other game to compare it to. Everything was brand new for the Sims 1.

Spore doesn't have an alternative either. Sure, there may be a few games that have traits similar, but overall there's nothing that comes close. Heck, the procedural animation is pretty much a first.

[WrathPhoenix]

As usual im the strong silent type. Been a fan for years, been a GS follower since the 2005 video. Big spore fan, probably one of the biggest...

I was looking forward to the original spore concept but I gotta say... I like what I got. I dont get nearly enough time to play, but Im enjoying it thoroughly. Yes there are issues, but having been in the game development industry im fully understanding to each of them.

The last poster mentioned something you all need to get to grips with. What everyone wants from spore is impossible without expansions. It was absolutely unfathomable to make a full game out of each and every stage.

Lets let Maxis do what they do best eh? Sims 1 was pretty much worthless until the expansions come along. Spore itself has miles more gameplay than those games... and it will continue to increase. So lets just let that happen.

Welp... back to my cave. Ciao.

[TDKenyon]

As usual im the strong silent type. Been a fan for years, been a GS follower since the 2005 video. Big spore fan, probably one of the biggest...

I was looking forward to the original spore concept but I gotta say... I like what I got. I dont get nearly enough time to play, but Im enjoying it thoroughly. Yes there are issues, but having been in the game development industry im fully understanding to each of them.

The last poster mentioned something you all need to get to grips with. What everyone wants from spore is impossible without expansions. It was absolutely unfathomable to make a full game out of each and every stage.

Lets let Maxis do what they do best eh? Sims 1 was pretty much worthless until the expansions come along. Spore itself has miles more gameplay than those games... and it will continue to increase. So lets just let that happen.

Welp... back to my cave. Ciao.

Thanks for coming out ! I'm glad there are more people who see things reasonably, especially those who are big fans of Spore. Spore hasn't even begun yet.