Author Topic: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed  (Read 8666 times)

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Offline Inkling

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Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« on: April 14, 2008, 09:42:13 pm »
http://www.expelledthemovie.com

This is a new documentary from Ben Stein (yes, that Ben Stein) about evolution and intelligent design.  I admit that I know very little about this movie,  I only heard what it was about yesterday.  So the rest of you can look into it along with me.

By the way, I see this thread turning into a mess very quickly, but maybe we can get some good discussion out of it before then.


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Offline Cool AN

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #1 on: April 15, 2008, 01:00:23 am »
I find the standpoint, that intelligent design should be taught in school as an alternative to evolution and that the "evolutionists" are holding the ID movement back, to be rather poor.

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Online Krakow Sam

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #2 on: April 15, 2008, 02:15:47 am »
Ah, this. Theres been a load of scandal regarding this in the evolution/design circles.

Critics have basically dismissed this as uninspired wannabe Michael Moor stuff, which I guess isn't too bad in itself. Apparently it doesn't end there because the only consistent theme in the film isn't one of intellectual freedom or rights to free speech, but the notion that belief in evolution somehow leads to Nazism and genocide >_<.
People started getting really angry when the guy who made the film started essentially bribing schools to take kids to see the film by offering cash incentives to the school that turned in the most ticket stubs.
Then it came to light that the guy had also lied to many of the contributing 'evolutionist' scientists, such as Richard Dawkins, who interviewed them on the premise the film was about something else, then subsequently stopped some of these contributers at the door and denied them entry when they tried to go to open screenings of the film.

But yeah, the wikipedia page expands on most of this. But it got good reviews from various christian organisations, so I guess it succeeded on the count of preaching to the converted.
Sam is basically right, he's just cranky.

Offline Brandonazz

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2008, 02:03:12 pm »
http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/03/expelled.php

Saw this blog a good while back.

As it turns out, this biologist was prevented entry, while Richard Dawkins himself walked right on through.

They had attended the function in a group together.

Offline Daxx

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2008, 03:28:35 pm »
Heh, I was just reading some stuff about this.

Here's some further reading for anyone that's interested (primarily debunking the film):
http://www.expelledexposed.com/

Online Krakow Sam

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Sam is basically right, he's just cranky.

Offline blitzonator

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2008, 08:41:52 am »
Nice....

NICE....

NICE!!!!

Offline Inkling

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2008, 01:29:17 pm »
Well, from the start I thought this looked like Stein trying to be the conservative Michael Moore.  Sounds like they used some of the same underhanded moves as Moore on this movie, so I guess I was right.
Probably not a Goat, either.


Offline Brandonazz

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2008, 06:14:07 pm »
I used to like Ben Stein.

Those clear eye commercials were just so inspirational.

Offline Kcronos

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2008, 10:52:10 pm »
Leave your religion out of our education!



Seperation of church and state!
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GET A HOLD OF YOURSELF MAN. THE REVIEWS DO NOT EFFECT ANYTHING EVER.

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Offline SmileyMan

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2008, 01:53:24 am »
Haha. Intelligent design is a joke.

Offline emmet

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #11 on: April 19, 2008, 04:29:58 pm »
No intelligence indeed.
No way dude, you're trolling me.

Offline Inkling

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #12 on: April 19, 2008, 07:30:08 pm »
I don't really feel like arguing over this one, I just felt like bringing it to your attention and seeing what the response would be.
Probably not a Goat, either.


Offline Draugr

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2008, 08:55:37 pm »
Commercial sort of annoyed me. It made it seem like science has no answer for where life first began.
Kings 2:23-24 --- The Holy Bible
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. "Go on up, you baldhead!" they said. "Go on up, you baldhead!" 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youth.

Offline smurfslayer

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2008, 07:17:56 am »
Commercial sort of annoyed me. It made it seem like science has no answer for where life first began.
......They don't.


(Okay, they have an answer but they still can't explain the very beginning)

Offline Andrew Ryan

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2008, 11:59:42 am »
Science has a theory for everything, including the beginning. They just haven't come up with a reasonably good one yet.
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Offline Brandonazz

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2008, 12:10:18 pm »
Oh? What, in your opinion, defines a good theory?

Offline Draugr

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2008, 04:34:43 pm »
Commercial sort of annoyed me. It made it seem like science has no answer for where life first began.
......They don't.


(Okay, they have an answer but they still can't explain the very beginning)

I'm referring to the start of life, not existence, bud. Read carefully. A scientist, named Stanley Miller found that when the methane, ammonia, hydrogen gas, and water vapor, all of which could be found in the early-earth atmosphere, were put into a beaker and exposed to a electric current, which simulates lightening, amino acids, the building blocks of proteins,organic compounds , could be formed. I know that was a bit wordy, but it was the best way I could put it.

bam
Kings 2:23-24 --- The Holy Bible
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. "Go on up, you baldhead!" they said. "Go on up, you baldhead!" 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youth.

Offline 762

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2008, 05:30:27 pm »
Commercial sort of annoyed me. It made it seem like science has no answer for where life first began.

Evolution does not deal with the beginning of life. It deals with how and why life went from simple to complex

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Offline Brandonazz

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2008, 05:56:12 pm »
bam



Also, thanks for saying that. I dislike people who make assumptions on facts without research.

Offline Inkling

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2008, 08:08:12 pm »
Commercial sort of annoyed me. It made it seem like science has no answer for where life first began.
......They don't.


(Okay, they have an answer but they still can't explain the very beginning)

I'm referring to the start of life, not existence, bud. Read carefully. A scientist, named Stanley Miller found that when the methane, ammonia, hydrogen gas, and water vapor, all of which could be found in the early-earth atmosphere, were put into a beaker and exposed to a electric current, which simulates lightening, amino acids, the building blocks of proteins,organic compounds , could be formed. I know that was a bit wordy, but it was the best way I could put it.

bam

Ok, but how did we get from those building blocks to something that could replicate itself?  I haven't studied biology in a while, but if memory serves, that's a really big jump.

Evolution does not deal with the beginning of life. It deals with how and why life went from simple to complex

Then what does deal with the beginning of life?
Probably not a Goat, either.


Offline LuceroJuarez

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #21 on: April 21, 2008, 02:52:21 pm »
Goat men in forum avatars deal with the beginning of life.

Offline blitzonator

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #22 on: April 22, 2008, 04:47:59 am »
I watched it and I had one word:

FULLALIEZ!

I hated it. I need some Darwin, quick! I'm going stupid here!

Offline GameManic

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #23 on: April 22, 2008, 06:11:58 am »
The field of science that deals with the origin of life is abiogenesis. 
These building blocks of life such as RNA are capable of self-replication by simply forming long chains of nucleotides and amino acids because their ends are capable of attaching themselves to other similar building blocks of life.
I found a good youtube video explaining the concepts in a simple way. Enjoy. <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozbFerzjkz4" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ozbFerzjkz4</a>
"Listen, I mean that from my knowledge of the world that I see around me, I think that it is much more likely that the reports of flying saucers are the results of the known irrational characteristics of terrestrial intelligence than of the unknown rational efforts of extra-terrestrial intelligence."
-Richard Feynman

Offline emmet

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #24 on: April 22, 2008, 11:27:15 am »
Wow! That was a great video! It made it so simple.
No way dude, you're trolling me.

Offline Yuu

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #25 on: April 27, 2008, 11:26:49 pm »
But didn't Miller's experiment yield a high amount of tar, which if my memory serves me right, destroys DNA.

Online Krakow Sam

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #26 on: April 28, 2008, 05:49:32 am »
But didn't Miller's experiment yield a high amount of tar, which if my memory serves me right, destroys DNA.

Seems unlikely, given that Tar is produced from already existing organic matter and generally has to be made out of cellulose or some other organic polymer.
Where did you hear that from?
Sam is basically right, he's just cranky.

Offline emmet

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #27 on: April 28, 2008, 09:49:31 am »
He answers Yuus question.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArCr-vnugbw" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArCr-vnugbw</a>
No way dude, you're trolling me.

Offline Werechicken

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #28 on: June 10, 2008, 10:23:42 am »
Um guys if you want to argue this:

http://www.gamingsteve.com/blab/index.php?topic=1038.0

Do it there.
What have you got against intellectual midgets? They're quite smart little guys as far as i can tell.

Offline Inkling

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #29 on: June 10, 2008, 11:35:21 am »
Seeing as no one has posted here since April, I'd say that's what happened. Werechicken.
Probably not a Goat, either.


Offline Werechicken

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Re: Ben Stein in Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed
« Reply #30 on: June 10, 2008, 12:12:26 pm »
oops, I was just looking at the most recent posts of the movies thread.  :-[
What have you got against intellectual midgets? They're quite smart little guys as far as i can tell.