Author Topic: "Artificial" misnomer  (Read 4045 times)

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Offline Draugr

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"Artificial" misnomer
« on: March 19, 2008, 04:15:35 pm »
The word "artificial" has always puzzled me. Why is that when humans create things they become "artificial" and therefore separate from nature. Technically isn't everything "natural"? Why is it that the marvel of plastics has been stamped as "artificial" and a spider's web is still a "natural" wonder? They both are just chemicals that have been combined by organism. Why as humans do we constantly feel the need to degrade ourselves as "unnatural"? Is it because we must feel that we have the power to destroy a planet?It is a known fact that when cellulose first appeared on Earth, no organisms could digest it, so it "polluted" the Earth's surface, but eventually some did. Once organisms evolved to digest cellulose it was no longer a "pollutant". So then, eventually a organism will most likely evolve to digest the plastic we have produced. Not much gets me as frustrated as when I hear a "scientist" get on TV and blather about how our meek few hundred years of industrialization have corrupted the Earth to the point of no return. Tell me then why the 4 billion years of volcanic eruptions haven't beaten us to punch? Why? Because the Earth can heal , and I would put money on the fact that Earth has gone worse things than a few hundred years of human industrialization.
*end rant*

...discuss     


Kings 2:23-24 --- The Holy Bible
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. "Go on up, you baldhead!" they said. "Go on up, you baldhead!" 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youth.

Offline /lurk

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #1 on: March 19, 2008, 04:19:36 pm »
Bad Swamp. Don't pick a fight with actual scientists unless you have something more substantial to back up your opinions with than angry rhetoric.

That only works on politicians.
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Offline Draugr

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #2 on: March 19, 2008, 04:37:38 pm »
Ha. Scientists, politicians not much of a difference nowadays. They both just say what people want to hear. Politician sees Americans hate the war in Iraq, so he says "I don't support the war in Iraq!", Scientist sees people like to here about how we humans can destroy Earth without even knowing it so he says "We are destroying the Earth and we didn't even know it, I have charts!", then he makes a Discovery channel special and goes to a early retirement (yeah! capitalism). Hell some politicians are even apparently under the impression that they are scientists. *cough* AL GORE *cough* *cough*
« Last Edit: March 19, 2008, 04:39:16 pm by swamp »
Kings 2:23-24 --- The Holy Bible
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. "Go on up, you baldhead!" they said. "Go on up, you baldhead!" 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youth.

Offline tomasgaquino

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2008, 04:40:37 pm »
Can't disagree on a few points, but that's exaggerating. There are people and people...
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Offline Mae

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2008, 04:44:09 pm »
LOSING BATTLE DETECTED

Offline 7 who ate 9

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2008, 05:56:41 pm »
I all ways thought about that, and I agree that we do call it unnatural as some way to put our selfs above nature, but besides that I really don't care. I mean, I do think green, even though no matter what we do is natural. Polluting the Earth is "natural", but you know, so is being extinct.
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Offline Draugr

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2008, 04:59:37 am »
LOSING BATTLE DETECTED

in order to lose a battle don't u have to be presented with a point u can't refute
« Last Edit: March 21, 2008, 01:36:18 pm by swamp »
Kings 2:23-24 --- The Holy Bible
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. "Go on up, you baldhead!" they said. "Go on up, you baldhead!" 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youth.

Offline /lurk

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2008, 12:17:48 pm »
Setting aside all of the scientific research regarding the phenomenon of global warming (you could always go and look in a peer-reviewed scientific journal, this being the one with the catchiest name), for a moment (since that would amount to 'a point u [sic] can't refute,' and I'm crazy enough to actually enjoy dismembering poorly-written troll rants on an internet forum,) I'll take  jab at your other point.

Out of the three real candidates for the U.S. president, only one is actually against the war in Iraq (if voting records are anything to go by,) despite that being the overwhelming public opinion. So politicians don't really just say what people want to hear, or we'd all have massive tax cuts and hundreds of new schools on the board for sometime when we're not completely broke. You underestimate the difficulty of actually managing a country with any reasonable degree of success. Along with your stance on global warming, this puts you in an uncomfortably similar place to George Bush Jr.

So now, back to science. I think it's pretty safe to ignore whatever opinions you might have regarding global warming, or pretty much any other scientific matter, since you don't seem to cite any evidence or research, and lack any credentials of any kind. I suppose I could subscribe to your religion and throw that old fashioned scientific method in the rubbish, but then I might as well stop trusting any kind of science and go back to living in terror of evil spirits and hunting for mammoths with my bare hands.

And, of course, the old spelling and grammar problem: It's not good. But mentioning that feels a bit pointless, when you're wrong in so many other ways.

You lose. Peace out.
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Offline sgore

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2008, 12:54:46 pm »
(Note: /Lurk posted just as I was finishing this up. Rather than not have wasted my time with this, I'm going to post in anyway and hope it's looked at as a friendly compliment to /Lurk's points.)
LOSING BATTLE DETECTED

in order to lose a battle don't u have to be presented with a point u can't repute
I think you mean refute.
And "You". Please don't substitute. "u" for "You" unless there are extenuating circumstances.

And on that note:
While you can go by the logic of us being natural means what we make is natural, instead of artificial, it's really just parsing words at that point. No matter what you call it, it's going to be what it is. The word "Artificial" is useful in classification. But either way, the fact that we use different words in referring to things, in no way backs up the not so thinly veiled argument you're making against global warming. And, according to your second post you also are apparently against politicians who are against the war in Iraq.

To dispute some of those points (With some citation):

Overall, the argument in your first post seems to lead up to the opinion that humans are in no way responsible for global warming. For now we'll ignore the fact that even the president has as of late admitted our greenhouse gases are a factor in global warming...(*cough* http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,485992,00.html *cough* ) and just focus on your argument. Your cite volcanoes as your reasoning behind your dispution of global warming? 
Well as one scientist stated specifically from this article: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2002/02/020220075850.htm
"'If you plug in volcanic eruptions, El Niños, solar variations and other natural causes and try to simulate past climate changes, you can do a pretty good job of modeling climate change until the end of the 19th Century After that period natural causes alone don't account for the amount of warming.'"

And as for why volcanoes haven't been doing it (by "it" I mean harming the ozone layer) in their billions of years before we came along, he goes on to say "'Elevated levels of chlorine in the stratosphere only started appearing within the last couple of decades due to human activity,'"

As to your other point, against politicians being against the Iraq war because Americans want them to be against the Iraq war...Isn't that the whole point of a republic? electing officials to represent the views and opinions of the people?
I'm not going to get into an argument about the Iraq war itself as this isn't the thread (and it wouldn't be fair to drive it off topic in that direction), but you seem to be saying that once in office politicians shouldn't listen to what their voters demand of them?
You then further push that into an analogy applying to scientists and again, Global warming. dismissing mounds of scientific research as "Look, I have charts!" may be convenient to your argument but it doesn't change the fact those charts have some basis.

Oh, and then you just slam Al Gore for some reason.

But anyway, I hope I made a reasonable argument.

Also:
Global Warming Thread: http://www.gamingsteve.com/blab/index.php?topic=9211.msg360493#msg360493
There's no offical Iraq war thread I know of but there are few topics relating to it:
The current US presidential election thread (So any debate you have in there would have to be in relation to the current candadates running for president): http://www.gamingsteve.com/blab/index.php?topic=9543.0
Regarding techniques related to the "War on Terror": http://www.gamingsteve.com/blab/index.php?topic=10977.msg458904#msg458904 (A few months old though.)
And if all else fails there's the general Politics Thread: http://www.gamingsteve.com/blab/index.php?topic=386.0 (but it's a couple years old, so I don't recommend bumping it without a very good reason.)
If none of these fit your bill you can always start an Iraq war debate topic, but it's a pretty touchy issue so I'd keep the debate respectful.

As for a slamming Al Gore thread I don't seem to be able to find anything in the search history.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2008, 01:26:16 pm by sgore »
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Offline Great Distance

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2008, 03:53:52 pm »
Well, I believe that people are a part of the nature. Pollution is natural. Yes, you can pollute the Earth all you like. It will heal eventually. Once the cause has disappeared, a new world will rise again. The Earth will survive and new species will come and go. Dinosaurs ruled the world for a while, but soon after they were gone there were new animals to take their place. We can ruin the world and the nature but in the end we will only destroy ourselves.

Offline Ryederz

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2008, 06:04:21 pm »
Swamp are you still studying??? i encountered that problem when i'm studying. kind'a confuse also but, manage to learn it.

Offline Draugr

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2008, 01:34:54 pm »
i'm not saying global warming doesn't, what im saying is that is not all humanity's fault. and by the way if u have one of those implants in your genitals that make u feel extreme pain when u see somebody use shorthand then u need to get a life
Kings 2:23-24 --- The Holy Bible
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. "Go on up, you baldhead!" they said. "Go on up, you baldhead!" 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youth.

Offline Draugr

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2008, 01:40:08 pm »
you also are apparently against politicians who are against the war in Iraq.

no it is just the most obvious example, when it comes to politicians, in any case the point of this thread was to point out the fact the artificial is a misnomer instead i got cyberraped
« Last Edit: March 21, 2008, 01:43:51 pm by swamp »
Kings 2:23-24 --- The Holy Bible
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. "Go on up, you baldhead!" they said. "Go on up, you baldhead!" 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youth.

Offline Quantum Burrito

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #13 on: March 22, 2008, 04:28:37 am »
i'm not saying global warming doesn't, what im saying is that is not all humanity's fault. and by the way if u have one of those implants in your genitals that make u feel extreme pain when u see somebody use shorthand then u need to get a life

If you don't have enough of a brain left to figure out why deliberately mangling the language that we rely on for communication is an incredibly stupid thing to do, then you really need to jump off of the nearest available cliff.
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Offline 762

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Re: "Artificial" misnomer
« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2008, 07:57:42 am »
and by the way if u have one of those implants in your genitals that make u feel extreme pain when u see somebody use shorthand then u need to get a life

Two extra letters to avoid all this mess, and to make yourself look like an intelligent person. Hell, I even capitalize and spell check, I must be a closet dwelling troll with severe groin pain by your standards. :P

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