Poll

Which are you?

I am an evolutionist (umbrella term)
205 (68.3%)
I am a creationist (umbrella term)
35 (11.7%)
other (both?  none?)
60 (20%)

Total Members Voted: 295

Author Topic: Evolution yes/no  (Read 367472 times)

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Offline Mr. Consideration

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1965 on: July 31, 2008, 03:14:25 pm »
Um no. Creationist and Evolutionist thought are completely opposite from one another, like the two sides of a coin. Creationists believe that an "Intellegent Being" (AKA God) created everything at once and that everything that existed then exists now. Evolutionists believe life changed gradually over the course of millions of years and that some things died out while other things changed to suit their environment.

Unless you believe a Diety guided the process of evolution, wherein mutations are down to random chance which could be within the hands of a god. Quite a few deists believe this.
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Offline Draugr

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1966 on: July 31, 2008, 06:57:30 pm »
I thought creationism deals with how life was made, and evolution deals with just how it evolved? Couldn't both coexists?

No, Creationism and Evolution cannot coexist, but if you mean Religion and Evolution, then yes. As long as you realize that religious text may just be big allegories and the Book of Genesis shouldn't be taken as a word for word true. 
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Offline Uroboros

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1967 on: July 31, 2008, 07:48:49 pm »
Unless by "coexist" you mean that Evolution can continue to provide insights into the observable world around us, and Creationism can continue to provide a morphous backpedalling way to keep religion 'up to date'? Then yes, they can coexist. Creationism and evolution collide no more than religion and science do, despite being completely different, creationism, like religion, can ignore the progress we have made and stick to blind faith. At least until someone decides they need to re-re-re-re-re-interpret the holy word again, and coincidentally end up in a position more viable to a modern mindset...

Offline Rusted

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1968 on: July 31, 2008, 08:02:21 pm »
I thought creationism deals with how life was made, and evolution deals with just how it evolved? Couldn't both coexists?

No, Creationism and Evolution cannot coexist, but if you mean Religion and Evolution, then yes. As long as you realize that religious text may just be big allegories and the Book of Genesis shouldn't be taken as a word for word true. 

Probably should throw out the whole first testament actually, I think most people would find the practicality of living in keeping with Leviticus might be a little difficult, even in an allegorical sense as it doesn't leave too much room for interpretation in most parts.


I think saying Creationism, which is an almost exclusively Christian sect adaptation of the bible,  can co-exist with evolution probably is rather misleading.  Even allegorically the bible is pretty specific about genealogies which in turn allows the extrapolation  of time period involved which directly conflict with very solid theories present in chemistry, astronomy, and geology.  Granted, I guess someone can counter and say "Well, the bible is allegorical at parts X X X, and not at X X X"  But that kinda goes against the whole "infallible word of god thing" and you might as well just pick up the brother's Grimm and say it's a selective-allegorical-interpretation of the word of god and use the same system. 


A more accurate statement would be that spirituality and science can co-exist.
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Offline MetallicDragon

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1969 on: July 31, 2008, 08:08:40 pm »
I thought creationism was just that the world was made in 7 days etc etc. What I meant was that someone could argue that the world was created by god "recently" but evolution is still possible, but just isn't what happened.

Clearly I'm showing my ignorance of Creationism.

Offline Rusted

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1970 on: July 31, 2008, 10:36:55 pm »

Clearly I'm showing my ignorance of Creationism.

Not at all, Creationism comes in all sorts of fantastic fun fruity flavors, that's more likely the problem.

Common use of the term generally refers to any for of development in which a god controlled the development of the species.

"Strict Creationism" generally holds that the bible is actually an accurate account of creation and that evolution is either a "trap" or simply man making a misjudgment.

But then there is Young Earth and Old Earth creationists too.  Young Earth argue that the bible is correct in that if you trace the lineages from Adam on through Abraham that the earth is only a little more than 6,000 years old.  **In my opinion these tend to be the more fanitical creation theorists.

The Old Earth creationists generally think that everything coincides with the fossil record, that most biblical time tables are allegorical accounts etc.

There are a couple other sub categories as well. One of the best if you want some reading is called something like Hydroplate creationism.  It's Awesome.


You'll also find a lot of people who are actually "deists" saying they're creationists.  Deism is actually a "faith" unto itself really, it's the general concept that a creator set things in motion (in modern day this generally implies a creator made the big bang) and then just watched the causality trickle through the ages, but rarely (or never depending on the person) gets involved.


The problem of course is that these are generally outside observations.  I haven't personally met too many creationists who sub categorize themselves.  All in all by most of the science community it's considered an amalgamated pseudo science that people try and use for legal justification to either ban evolution instruction in public schools, or allow the teaching of a quasi-biblical lessons in public education under the label of "official science".
« Last Edit: July 31, 2008, 10:44:24 pm by Rusted »
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Offline Yokto

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1971 on: August 01, 2008, 07:30:26 am »
The problem with the idea of god just starting up the universes is that god is also said to be omni sentient. So God knew how it would all play out before he even created big bang. Not that a all might being can not create everything without anyone know it did it.

But then again is more a problem for man if man wants to believe he got free will and god is good.

But then i say people are missing the greater question. Is not a question weather god is good or not. Is question why god would create a universe at all.
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Offline Met

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1972 on: August 06, 2008, 01:04:20 am »
The problem with intelligent design theory is not that it is false but that it is not falsifiable: Not being susceptible to contradicting evidence, it is not a testable hypothesis. Hence it is not a scientific but a creedal tenet--a matter of faith, unsuited to a public school’s curriculum.
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Offline Brandonazz

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1973 on: November 29, 2008, 10:42:58 am »
Not entirely relevant to evolution but pretty cool.

Offline Bona Fide Supraman

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1974 on: December 01, 2008, 11:07:27 am »
Wow, I was about to do a massive reply, and then realised I was on page one and the posts were over 3 years old....

Speaking of God creation and Big Bang: I don't get why Creationists insist on saying "where did all the matter come from then?" yet can keep a straight face whilst saying "God has always been here, he's omniblahblahblah."

I think that a good point to remember is that if the Big Bang had not occurred, then we wouldn't be here to say "why did that not happen then?"

@ Brandon, that is pretty cool
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Offline Brutus

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1975 on: December 02, 2008, 09:11:43 am »
the thing that irritates me is when creationsist speak badly about science. To Quote the idiot Tony48219 from youtube (please go and spam and flame his channel "What has science done for us!? Science hasn't done **** for us it's done nothing!!"

Ungrateful idiot.
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Offline Veraal

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1976 on: December 02, 2008, 09:29:03 am »
Do you know what a troll is?

Offline Brutus

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1977 on: December 02, 2008, 09:30:02 am »
yes.

He deserves it.
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Offline Veraal

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1978 on: December 02, 2008, 09:31:47 am »
Then wouldn't you consider the fact that he's just trolling your bottom?
« Last Edit: December 02, 2008, 09:34:31 am by Veraal »

Offline Brutus

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Re: Evolution yes/no
« Reply #1979 on: December 02, 2008, 09:33:04 am »
he's trolling my bottom?
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