Gaming Steve Message Board

Games, Games, and More Games => Forum Games => Topic started by: Quantum Burrito on August 24, 2009, 11:10:09 am

Title: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 24, 2009, 11:10:09 am
For those of you not familiar with nomic, it's a game where changing the rules of the game is an allowed rule. That's basically it. All you can really say, because as a result, the game is immensely variable. It's turn based (initially), which makes it ideal for forum gaming, I think.

Let me know if you're interested in playing. You will be added to the game so long as a simple majority of current players agree to let you in. I have  no discretion in this, or any other rule. Please do not moan at me.

Also feel free to ask if the rules seem unclear, or you have any other concerns.

Current proposal (proposed by putspooza):
---
309. I propose to change rule 308 to read the following: "Every player is an eligible voter. Every eligible voter must participate in every vote on rule-changes. If a period of 8 days has passed and not all voters have voted, the remaining voters' votes will be ignored and the they will lose 5 points each."
---
5 votes for, 1 vote against
Awaiting votes from: Quantum Burrito, putspooza, Kenotai, Yannick, dndfreak, kenobro and Detoxicated

Previous Proposal (Proposed by Quantum Burrito):
---
Rule change proposal #308: Rule #105 becomes mutable
---
Final count:
4 votes for, 3 votes against.
Motion passes: rule 105 is now rule 308. Quantum Burrito gains 10 points for positive votes; dndfreak, putspooza and Kenotai gain 10 points apiece for voting against a passing motion.

List of players:
Quantum Burrito: 5
putspooza: 41
Kenotai: 40
Yannick: 17
dndfreak: 14
kenobro: 10
Detoxicated: 5

The current rules for Forum Nomic are as follows:

---
101* All players must always abide by all the rules then in effect, in the form in which they are then in effect. The rules in the Initial Set are in effect whenever a game begins. The Initial Set consists of Rules 101-116 (immutable) and 201-213 (mutable).
---
102* Initially rules in the 100's are immutable and rules in the 200's are mutable. Rules subsequently enacted or transmuted (that is, changed from immutable to mutable or vice versa) may be immutable or mutable regardless of their numbers, and rules in the Initial Set may be transmuted regardless of their numbers.
---
103* A rule-change is any of the following: (1) the enactment, repeal, or amendment of a mutable rule; (2) the enactment, repeal, or amendment of an amendment of a mutable rule; or (3) the transmutation of an immutable rule into a mutable rule or vice versa.

(Note: This definition implies that, at least initially, all new rules are mutable; immutable rules, as long as they are immutable, may not be amended or repealed; mutable rules, as long as they are mutable, may be amended or repealed; any rule of any status may be transmuted; no rule is absolutely immune to change.)
---
104* All rule-changes proposed in the proper way shall be voted on. They will be adopted if and only if they receive the required number of votes.
---
106* All proposed rule-changes shall be posted before they are voted on. If they are adopted, they shall guide play in the form in which they were voted on, notwithstanding subsequent changes to the forum post.

All current rules shall be kept, in numeric order, in the "statutes at large", which shall be in the original post. Immutable rules shall be signified with an asterisk (*), and mutable ones with a full stop (.). Rules shall be separated by a line consisting of only three hyphens (---).
---
107* No rule-change may take effect earlier than the moment of the completion of the vote that adopted it, even if its wording explicitly states otherwise. No rule-change may have retroactive application.
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108* Each proposed rule-change shall be given a number for reference. The numbers shall begin with 301, and each rule-change proposed in the proper way shall receive the next successive integer, whether or not the proposal is adopted.

If a rule is repealed and reenacted, it receives the number of the proposal to reenact it. If a rule is amended or transmuted, it receives the number of the proposal to amend or transmute it. If an amendment is amended or repealed, the entire rule of which it is a part receives the number of the proposal to amend or repeal the amendment.
---
109* Rule-changes that transmute immutable rules into mutable rules may be adopted if and only if the vote is unanimous among the eligible voters. Transmutation shall not be implied, but must be stated explicitly in a proposal to take effect.
---
110* In a conflict between a mutable and an immutable rule, the immutable rule takes precedence and the mutable rule shall be entirely void. For the purposes of this rule a proposal to transmute an immutable rule does not "conflict" with that immutable rule.
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111* If a rule-change as proposed is unclear, ambiguous, paradoxical, or destructive of play, or if it arguably consists of two or more rule-changes compounded or is an amendment that makes no difference, or if it is otherwise of questionable value, then the other players may suggest amendments or argue against the proposal before the vote. A reasonable time must be allowed for this debate. The proponent decides the final form in which the proposal is to be voted on and, unless the Judge has been asked to do so, also decides the time to end debate and vote.
---
112* The state of affairs that constitutes winning may not be altered from achieving n points to any other state of affairs. The magnitude of n and the means of earning points may be changed, and rules that establish a winner when play cannot continue may be enacted and (while they are mutable) be amended or repealed.
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113* A player always has the option to forfeit the game rather than continue to play or incur a game penalty. No penalty worse than losing, in the judgement of the player to incur it, may be imposed.
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114* There must always be at least one mutable rule. The adoption of rule-changes must never become completely impermissible.
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115* Rule-changes that affect rules needed to allow or apply rule-changes are as permissible as other rule-changes. Even rule-changes that amend or repeal their own authority are permissible. No rule-change or type of move is impermissible solely on account of the self-reference or self-application of a rule.
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116* Whatever is not prohibited or regulated by a rule is permitted and unregulated, with the sole exception of changing the rules, which is permitted only when a rule or set of rules explicitly or implicitly permits it.
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202. One turn consists of two parts in this order: (1) proposing one rule-change and having it voted on, and (2) subtracting 291 from the ordinal number of their proposal and multiplying the result by the fraction of favorable votes it received, rounded to the nearest integer. This number shall then be added to the player's score. (This yields a number between 0 and 10 for the first player, with the upper limit increasing by one each turn; more points are awarded for more popular proposals.)
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203. A rule-change is adopted if and only if a simple majority of voters agree to it.
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204. If and when rule-changes can be adopted without unanimity, the players who vote against winning proposals shall receive 10 points each.
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205. An adopted rule-change takes full effect at the moment of the completion of the vote that adopted it.
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206. When a proposed rule-change is defeated, the player who proposed it loses 10 points.
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207. Each player always has exactly one vote.
---
208. The winner is the first player to achieve 200 (positive) points.
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209. At no time may there be more than 25 mutable rules.
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210. If two or more mutable rules conflict with one another, or if two or more immutable rules conflict with one another, then the rule with the lowest ordinal number takes precedence.

If at least one of the rules in conflict explicitly says of itself that it defers to another rule (or type of rule) or takes precedence over another rule (or type of rule), then such provisions shall supersede the numerical method for determining precedence.

If two or more rules claim to take precedence over one another or to defer to one another, then the numerical method again governs.
---
211. If players disagree about the legality of a move or the interpretation or application of a rule, then the player preceding the one moving is to be the Judge and decide the question. Disagreement for the purposes of this rule may be created by the insistence of any player. This process is called invoking Judgment.

When Judgment has been invoked, the next player may not begin his or her turn without the consent of a majority of the other players.

The Judge's Judgment may be overruled only by a unanimous vote of the other players taken before the next turn is begun. If a Judge's Judgment is overruled, then the player preceding the Judge in the playing order becomes the new Judge for the question, and so on, except that no player is to be Judge during his or her own turn or during the turn of a team-mate.

Unless a Judge is overruled, one Judge settles all questions arising from the game until the next turn is begun, including questions as to his or her own legitimacy and jurisdiction as Judge.

New Judges are not bound by the decisions of old Judges. New Judges may, however, settle only those questions on which the players currently disagree and that affect the completion of the turn in which Judgment was invoked. All decisions by Judges shall be in accordance with all the rules then in effect; but when the rules are silent, inconsistent, or unclear on the point at issue, then the Judge shall consider game-custom and the spirit of the game before applying other standards.
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212. If the rules are changed so that further play is impossible, or if the legality of a move cannot be determined with finality, or if by the Judge's best reasoning, not overruled, a move appears equally legal and illegal, then the first player unable to complete a turn is the winner.

This rule takes precedence over every other rule determining the winner.
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303. Players shall alternate in the order they joined the game, or applied to join the game, taking one whole turn apiece. Turns may not be skipped or passed, and parts of turns may not be omitted. The begining number of points for newcomes will be the lowest scoring persons score, less one tenth, rounded down.  If the lowest score is in fact zero, then the newcomer shall also have zero, and the less one tenth, rounded, clause will not apply.
x-(x/10), where x is the lowest score upon entry.
---
304. Whenever a new player requests to join, the current players hold a vote. If the majority of the eligible voters accept the new player, he can join the game.
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307. if a player can not complete his turn due to not being active for at least 5 days, his turn is skipped and passed on to the next player in line. Any player who does not manage to post his change-rule in time gets a penalty of -10 points.
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308. Every player is an eligible voter. Every eligible voter must participate in every vote on rule-changes.
---
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 24, 2009, 11:26:34 am
This looks really complicated, but I'll give it a shot.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 24, 2009, 11:39:28 am
This looks really complicated, but I'll give it a shot.

Thanks! That's two people now. Don't worry, once you get into the swing of things, it's not that complicated. Unless you make it complicated. But most of the complex rules deal with contingencies.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 24, 2009, 12:44:45 pm
I'll try it out.   It looks much better than the other forum games.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 24, 2009, 12:50:55 pm
I'll try it out.   It looks much better than the other forum games.

Thanks. Name added, two more people needed before I will start the game. (Ain't no rule saying you can't join after the game starts!)
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 24, 2009, 04:07:30 pm
Ain't no rule saying you can't join after the game starts!

Yet.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on August 24, 2009, 04:30:30 pm
I'll play.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 24, 2009, 05:16:31 pm
I'll play.

Thanks, added to the list. One more person!
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 25, 2009, 06:30:34 am
You know what, waiting for a fifth player is not going to help my chronic boredom. So without further ado, the game of Forum Nomic begins! Again, feel free to join in still, you'll be added on to the end of the round of turns. Also note that a running total of points has been added to the OP.

Anyway, My rule change proposal, #301, is:

---
After every full round of turns, an election shall be held for the position of Appellate Judge. The person holding a simple plurality of votes shall be chosen to serve until the next election. In the event of a tie, the candidate who joined the game earliest shall be chosen.

After judgement has been called, a simple majority of players may call for an appeal to the Appellate Judge, the ruling of whom is final.

All provisions of this rule shall be taken to supersede rule #211, including that this rule shall repeal the appeal process specified therein
---

Now we vote. Yes, it's a boring proposal, but I had no better ideas and I can't skip my go.

EDIT: PS I vote yes
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 25, 2009, 06:36:19 am
do we just say "yay" or "neigh" now? or is there a procedure?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 25, 2009, 06:54:11 am
do we just say "yay" or "neigh" now? or is there a procedure?

There's no rule laying out the procedure... So I guess, by rule 116, that you just make your vote known however. So yes, a simple "yay" or "neigh" will do.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 25, 2009, 08:23:43 am
Well in that case , neigh.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 25, 2009, 08:26:51 am
Yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 25, 2009, 08:29:34 am
and now we need to wait for Grangan to show up.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 25, 2009, 09:45:59 am
and now we need to wait for Grangan to show up.
Ahhh... yes. Well, I suppose this could be a slow paced game. Well, it's a forum game, of course it's slow paced. Of course, the rule defining voting procedure (#203) is mutable. And it is your go next. You know, if this bothers you.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 25, 2009, 10:02:51 am
203 just defines what ratio of yays:neighs is needed for a vote to pass.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 25, 2009, 10:37:51 am
Ah, yes, I suppose rule 105 is the more pertinent rule. And it is immutable. And transmutation requires unanimity.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 25, 2009, 11:29:41 am
I can't find the rule that says players can't skip their turn.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 25, 2009, 01:07:56 pm
Rule 201
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 25, 2009, 01:42:07 pm
Ah yes.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: emmet on August 26, 2009, 06:05:32 am
So do we just propose rules now?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 26, 2009, 06:39:05 am
So do we just propose rules now?

We need to wait for everyone to vote -.- it's turn based...
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 26, 2009, 08:45:38 am
You know, by rule 116, I could kick grangan out, because if he' not going to participate there's no point having him blocking us. And alwayswatching, do you want to join?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on August 26, 2009, 09:01:00 am
I would like to join as well.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 26, 2009, 09:27:20 am
I would like to join as well.

You're in, grangan's out, you vote then it's putspooza's turn.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 26, 2009, 09:52:48 am
how is grangan out?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 26, 2009, 09:53:24 am
He hasn't been participating, duh.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 26, 2009, 09:58:12 am
And there's no rule saying I can't, so by rule 116, I can. He can rejoin if he's going to actually participate.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 26, 2009, 10:00:48 am
I guess you're right.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on August 26, 2009, 10:01:44 am
I vote against the motion.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 26, 2009, 10:04:22 am
So there's a tie

*checks rules about ties*

wait it doesn't matter, no simple majority, rule denied.

EDIT:


Role proposal #302. :

---
if a player can not complete his turn due to not being active for at least 5 days, his turn is skipped and passed on to the next player in line.
---

I vote yes.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 26, 2009, 01:44:04 pm
I vote yes.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on August 26, 2009, 02:43:49 pm
I vote yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on August 26, 2009, 03:24:16 pm
I want to join before a rule is made I cannot.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 26, 2009, 03:53:35 pm
I want to join before a rule is made I cannot.

Done. Don't forget to vote!

EDIT: I'm not sure if this rule is valid. It conflicts with rule 201. If it had been an amendment to that rule, it'd be fine. But as it is, it might be rendered void if someone calls for judgement when it's used.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 26, 2009, 07:35:55 pm
EDIT: I'm not sure if this rule is valid. It conflicts with rule 201. If it had been an amendment to that rule, it'd be fine. But as it is, it might be rendered void if someone calls for judgement when it's used.

What, my rule?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on August 26, 2009, 09:59:44 pm
I vote yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 26, 2009, 10:21:46 pm
so know we need bro's and yannick's votes
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 27, 2009, 05:13:28 am
EDIT: I'm not sure if this rule is valid. It conflicts with rule 201. If it had been an amendment to that rule, it'd be fine. But as it is, it might be rendered void if someone calls for judgement when it's used.

What, my rule?

Yeah, 201 states that turns cannot be skipped. Your rule says they can... of course, it could be validated by "case law" if someone calls for judgement.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on August 27, 2009, 05:41:46 am
I vote yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 27, 2009, 07:26:16 am
I've counted grangan's vote, and added him back in, on the assumption that he'll actually participate now. Grangan, you better check back regularly to vote and take your turn. I don't want to have to keep adding and removing you!
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 27, 2009, 08:26:23 am
I vote yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 27, 2009, 08:58:05 am
So I guess it passed unanimously?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 27, 2009, 09:20:32 am
So I guess it passed unanimously?
Yes, the rules and points have been adjusted appropriately. Kenobro's turn to propose a motion.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 28, 2009, 07:02:09 am
I propose to change the rule that says people can't skip their turns.

I vote yes.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on August 28, 2009, 07:09:02 am
Neigh.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 28, 2009, 08:11:46 am
I shall refrain from voting, temporarily. I instead choose to invoke rule #111. I believe your rule-change is ambiguous, and lacks a proper written form. I suggest a clearer, amended proposal, e.g.

303. The words "Turns may not be skipped or passed, and" shall be omitted from rule 201
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on August 28, 2009, 08:15:34 am
I as well shall refrain from voting.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 28, 2009, 10:12:07 am
I shall refrain from voting

I as well shall refrain from voting.

But...but...

Quote from: Quantum Burrito
---
105* Every player is an eligible voter. Every eligible voter must participate in every vote on rule-changes.
---
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 28, 2009, 10:51:03 am
I shall refrain from voting

I as well shall refrain from voting.

But...but...

Quote from: Quantum Burrito
---
105* Every player is an eligible voter. Every eligible voter must participate in every vote on rule-changes.
---

For now. As long as we are debating the rule under rule 111.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 28, 2009, 11:11:14 am
well then your not refraining fro voting, your just telling him to change it before you vote, refraining from voting would be not voting on this proposal at all, no matter what.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 28, 2009, 12:26:21 pm
well then your not refraining fro voting, your just telling him to change it before you vote, refraining from voting would be not voting on this proposal at all, no matter what.

I did say temporarily in my post. We need to wait for kenobro, to settle this.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 28, 2009, 12:34:29 pm
I don't get it, why should the wording matter so much?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 28, 2009, 01:02:11 pm
I don't get it, why should the wording matter so much?

Because that's the whole point of this game, to define rules, and rules need to be defined so they would serve their purpose, or else someone would do what ever they want and say "well I thought this rule let's me that", if the rule is ambiguous, it might as well not exist as to not cause confusion.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on August 28, 2009, 09:28:45 pm
...why the hell would the wording of the rule NOT matter?  Ambiguity is NOT a good thing for rules.  Ambiguity is what produces lawyers.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 29, 2009, 03:45:51 am
and we all know how much we like lawyers.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on August 29, 2009, 02:23:30 pm
If he refuses to remove the ambiguity, I will vote Neigh to the proposal.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 29, 2009, 02:31:59 pm
I don't get it, how is it ambiguous?

Someone said there was a rule saying players can't skip their turns.

Were they lying?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on August 29, 2009, 02:50:58 pm
Can I get in on this game?

And Kenobro, the Idea is to make the wording as clear as possible so others can't take advantage of it later.

I propose to change the rule that says people can't skip their turns.

Change it to what?  Under your proposal, some @hole judge could interpret that law to mean anything, like for example "you win if your username is dndfreak.  This law can not be muted."  This is why you need to specify what you want the new version of the rule to be.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 29, 2009, 03:37:28 pm
How would someone interpret it that way?

Alright, fine.  I propose that players can skip their turns.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on August 29, 2009, 03:41:13 pm
Now that rule just wouldn't do anything, because a different rule says that if rules conflict, the rule with lowest ordinal number takes precedence unless the rule with higher ordinal number specifically mentions the other rule.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on August 29, 2009, 03:44:02 pm
In other words, Kenobro proposes to transpose rule 201 by removing "Turns may not be skipped or passed, and".  This is exactly what burrito said earlier.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 30, 2009, 01:00:43 am
Basically the last two posts describe my opinion on what you should do.

But he should word it as such so it is clear that we wishes to perform that action on rule 201.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 30, 2009, 05:52:41 pm
Uh-oh. I think kenobro's been scared off. By semantics. I'm going to PM him to see if he has had enough of the game, what with it being about two days since he last posted  :-\


EDIT:
Can I get in on this game?

Yes, indded you can. If it doesn't die... You've been added to the roster.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on August 30, 2009, 10:46:27 pm
By semantics.

I really don't know what did he expect, all the rules present including the two ones proposed before his were laid out clearly, it's not like we sit and think of a way to word it for fun, we do it so the rule is possible, and as such the game will be possible, and from that the fun will be derived.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 31, 2009, 07:28:54 am
What's this BS about me being scared away?  I just saw no reason to post.

Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 31, 2009, 07:50:10 am
What's this BS about me being scared away?  I just saw no reason to post.



Sorry, that's me, I'm bad at assessing intentions >.<

Basically, the problem is this:

There is a rule, #201, which states no skipping of turns. Any rule created after it is overridden by it, as per rule #210.

Therefore, your proposal must be an amendment to that rule in order to have any effect.

Also, the wording of rules should be as clear and precise as possible, and phrased as a rule; so your proposal was badly formed. Look at the previous two proposals to see what I mean.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 31, 2009, 12:55:59 pm
I am pleased to announce that I have resolved the situation with kenobro. He has decided that he does not like the game, and has left. No, I did not push him, he just decided making rules was not his bag.

So, without further ado, Kenotai, please give us your proposal #303

(kenobro's #303 didn't happen)
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on August 31, 2009, 01:15:03 pm
---
303. Amendment to rule 201.  The begining number of points for newcomes will be the lowest scoring persons score, less one tenth, rounded down.  If the lowest score is in fact zero, then the newcomer shall also have zero, and the less one tenth, rounded, clause will not apply.
x-(x/10), where x is the lowest score upon entry.
---
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on August 31, 2009, 01:17:43 pm
So if I understand it correctly, if the lowest score is -5 than -0.5 the newcomer would have a scare of -5.5?

If so, Yay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 31, 2009, 01:19:27 pm
Ooooh, I'm so tempted to invoke rule 111 again. But no. I vote yay. A judge can sort it out later, that way it's not my problem :P
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on August 31, 2009, 01:22:23 pm
But this rule isn't destructive to play, paradoxical nor ambiguous? It's fairly clear in its meaning and if anything, will keep the game fair by not putting newcomers over other players.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 31, 2009, 01:25:14 pm
But this rule isn't destructive to play, paradoxical nor ambiguous? It's fairly clear in its meaning and if anything, will keep the game fair by not putting newcomers over other players.

One tenth could mean 0.1, or 0.1*score. It is slightly ambiguous, but as I said, nothing a judge can't iron out if it becomes a problem.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on August 31, 2009, 01:28:45 pm
Yannick, it's one tenth rounded.  If it's a single digit, that means that they would get the same score, minus one.  So -5, the newcomer would have -6.

Less one tenth.  That means, where score is x, x-(x/10).
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on August 31, 2009, 01:29:55 pm
Maybe use the word minus instead of less to clarify.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 31, 2009, 01:30:20 pm
Am I still allowed to vote?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 31, 2009, 01:32:26 pm
Yannick, it's one tenth rounded.  If it's a single digit, that means that they would get the same score, minus one.  So -5, the newcomer would have -6.

Less one tenth.  That means, where score is x, x-(x/10).

Do you think you could amend your proposal with the maths? It's just that it's less likely to lead to arguments...

Am I still allowed to vote?
No, you said you wanted out of the game. I assumed you meant it. Technically, I could add you on to the end of players, but there's no point as you don't like proposing rules.

EDIT: Actually, is there anything in the rules to stop a non-player voting? Because if not, by rule #116...

EDIT: Actually, although rule #203 says "voters" it could be interpreted to mean "eligible voters". You know what? Let's not go there. No need to call for judgement this early on in a game.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on August 31, 2009, 01:48:59 pm
I don't think there's anything saying that someone can't quit when their turn comes up and then rejoin once the next player's turn starts.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 31, 2009, 01:59:52 pm
I don't think there's anything saying that someone can't quit when their turn comes up and then rejoin once the next player's turn starts.

*sigh* No, there isn't. I mean, it will reset your score, but you could if you wanted to. So, kenobro, let me know if that's what you're doing.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on August 31, 2009, 02:00:38 pm
I suppose.  I'll have to think of what rule I want to propose once it becomes my turn again.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on August 31, 2009, 02:07:26 pm
I suppose.  I'll have to think of what rule I want to propose once it becomes my turn again.

Done.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 01, 2009, 11:59:05 am
I vote yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 01, 2009, 12:04:10 pm
I vote yay as well.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 02, 2009, 11:31:04 am
I vote yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 03, 2009, 11:44:15 am
wait am I the only voter left?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 03, 2009, 11:48:25 am
wait am I the only voter left?


You and Kenotai. It's basically passed already, but all players must vote!
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 03, 2009, 12:04:48 pm
oh in that case, neigh.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on September 03, 2009, 01:29:04 pm
Wait, isn't it kinda implied that because I proposed it, I support it?  Wierd.

Regardless, you need it, and it is yay. 
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 03, 2009, 02:35:23 pm
Motion carried then. Rules and points updated; take it away Yannick!
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on September 03, 2009, 03:05:45 pm
#304: Whenever a new player requests to join, the current players hold a vote. If the majority of the eligible voters accept the new player, (s)he can join the game.

I vote yay obviously.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 03, 2009, 03:06:52 pm
I vote yay.  Quality control FTW.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 03, 2009, 03:11:29 pm
Hold on a sec.  There's a rule already that says that a player can join at any time and is automatically added.  This proposal should be an amendment, not a new rule.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 03, 2009, 03:22:11 pm
Hold on a sec.  There's a rule already that says that a player can join at any time and is automatically added.  This proposal should be an amendment, not a new rule.

Is there? I thought that was a rule #116 power? Well, yay unless you can cite the rule. In which case please invoke rule #111.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 03, 2009, 03:30:29 pm
Actually, I've found a hole.  None of the original rules dictate joining the game.  In other words, none of us were allowed to start playing in the first place.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 03, 2009, 03:54:58 pm
Actually, I've found a hole.  None of the original rules dictate joining the game.  In other words, none of us were allowed to start playing in the first place.

*sigh* Please re-read rule 116.

Joining the game is not prohibited, and therefore is allowed.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 03, 2009, 04:15:33 pm
Well that seems like a really crappy rule.  Damn this game and it's vagueness.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 03, 2009, 04:19:02 pm
Well that seems like a really crappy rule.  Damn this game and it's vagueness.

Crappy rule? It's an implicit rule of all fair legal systems! Have you ever been arrested by a constable for something on the basis that no law explicitly authorises you to do so? Of course not, you're arrested because a law says you can't do what you are doing.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 03, 2009, 04:24:25 pm
Well that seems like a really crappy rule.  Damn this game and it's vagueness.

If you read the rules before joining it wouldn't be vague.

I vote yay to the current proposal.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 03, 2009, 05:39:21 pm
Oh, I read every last one of em.  It's just that since it's not exactly last rule, I thought that everything that should be covered should be covered.  However, it seems to me now that this lets a lot of loose ends get through...

Ah well, I'll vote nay.  Last thing we need is a flame war going on over people not letting others play.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 04, 2009, 05:03:29 pm
Oh, you should add a /she to the proposal so as not to be sexist.  Just something I noticed that's a minor detail.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 05, 2009, 01:58:36 am
Oh, you should add a /she to the proposal so as not to be sexist.  Just something I noticed that's a minor detail.

oh c'mon, we'll add she when we get a female player
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 05, 2009, 07:16:17 am
But why should we wait, it's just a minor detail anyway.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 05, 2009, 08:34:59 am
it's just a minor detail anyway.


that's why its not important.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 05, 2009, 08:36:40 am
Although technically, a female player could do whatever they want by claiming that rules wouldn't apply to them.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 05, 2009, 08:40:26 am
I do believe a lot of rules are in plural form though. I guess it's okay to add "/she" but I just woudn't like this to turn into one of those "he/she" on every single thing.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 05, 2009, 08:43:01 am
Of course you could go into word and find/replace the whole thing.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 05, 2009, 09:18:31 am
Let us assume for the purposes of the game that "he" is unisex.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 05, 2009, 06:10:56 pm
Let us assume for the purposes of the game that "he" is unisex.

You know, a rule could be created to make that official...
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 05, 2009, 07:54:07 pm
I was gonna say that...

I don't even remember what the proposed rule was anymore.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on September 06, 2009, 05:05:01 am
Then go back a page or two >_>
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 07, 2009, 07:40:06 am
Who hasn't voted yet?  Hasn't everybody voted?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 07, 2009, 08:05:00 am
its up to me and someone else, i dont know who.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 07, 2009, 08:08:42 am
Well, are you going to vote or not?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 07, 2009, 08:41:17 am
I have to vote.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on September 07, 2009, 08:42:12 am
Well then do it brainiac.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 07, 2009, 09:13:25 am
who said I have to vote now and not last?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 07, 2009, 09:14:01 am
Dude, just vote already.  Why would the other person's vote influence your vote anyway?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 07, 2009, 09:21:05 am
it wouldn't, I just don't see how it's an issue that I want to vote after the other person. anyways, in case he is in the same situation as I am, and is waiting for me to vote before he votes. I vote neigh.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on September 07, 2009, 09:51:04 am
It's me your waiting for.  Nay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 07, 2009, 12:19:44 pm
Motion carried. Rules and points updated.

By the way, I keep the current and previous proposal, along with a running tally of votes, in the OP.

Anyway, grangan's turn.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 07, 2009, 12:21:20 pm
You should also list who hasn't voted.  Just a suggestion.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 07, 2009, 12:36:14 pm
everyone must vote. everyone votes. there is no reason to keep a list of those who do not vote.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 07, 2009, 12:38:45 pm
I know, I'm saying so that they are aware if they haven't.  Like in the Mafia games there is a list of people who have voted and who haven't.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on September 07, 2009, 12:54:19 pm
Question, my rule was carried, why do I not have any points? D:
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 07, 2009, 01:00:00 pm
Question, my rule was carried, why do I not have any points? D:

You know that feeling, where you know you've forgotten to do something, but you can't for the life of you think of what it is? Yeah, that's why. Sorry!
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 07, 2009, 01:09:20 pm
So it's grangan's turn...

Come on, what's the proposal?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 07, 2009, 01:10:24 pm
Be patient.  He's not even online.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 08, 2009, 09:39:25 am
I propose to modify rule 303.  The new text of rule 303 is as follows:
Players shall alternate in the order they joined the game, or applied to join the game, taking one whole turn apiece. A player may skip their turn, at the loss of five points, but if they choose to use their turn, then parts of turns may not be omitted. The begining number of points for newcomers will be the lowest scoring person's score, less one tenth, rounded down.  If the lowest score is in fact zero, then the newcomer shall also have zero, and the less one tenth, rounded, clause will not apply.
x-(x/10), where x is the lowest score upon entry.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 08, 2009, 10:18:53 am
Aye! Aye! A million times, aye!

*checks rules*
*finds rule #207*

Damn, I guess only one aye then. Oh, and you need to vote, Grangan.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on September 08, 2009, 10:37:27 am
Neigh. A tenth of zero is still zero, redundant rule is redundant.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 08, 2009, 10:52:07 am
Aye.  Also, I wasn't modifying that bit, I'm only including it as a previous modification.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 08, 2009, 11:45:25 am
Redundant or not, it may prove useful later.  However, what would happen if the person with the lowest score was negative?  Do you give the new player zero or penalize him for things that they didn't even do?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 08, 2009, 11:50:56 am
(Yay or nye, dndfreak.  just a reminder, because you seemed to forget the proposal last time)

I vote nay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 08, 2009, 12:03:33 pm
Last time I yayed it early on.  First or second to vote.

As for me, I think it may use a little more, but for now I vote yay anyways.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 10, 2009, 03:02:26 am
Neigh.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 10, 2009, 05:09:59 am
Looks like Kenotai has the deciding vote...
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 10, 2009, 05:36:00 pm
I would like to reemphasize, as some here seem to misunderstand, that my edit was NOT the one tenth for new entries thing clause.  That was a previous edit.  My edit was the ability to skip turns at the expense of five points.  Thus the one tenth thing is unrelated to the change.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Detoxicated on September 11, 2009, 07:51:30 pm
i wanna join
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 12, 2009, 03:45:47 am
Okay, detoxicated. I say, to keep things simple, we vote on whether he/she gets to join between rule votes. Of course, you guys feel free to vote on it now, there's no official regulation.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on September 12, 2009, 05:02:08 am
I say he can join.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 12, 2009, 08:29:57 pm
I know'im, he'll just lazily drop out.  Neigh.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Detoxicated on September 13, 2009, 03:33:19 am
says the guy who has abandoned many games and was missing the first three pages of this thread
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on September 13, 2009, 06:00:22 am
He can join.

I vote no on this proposal.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 13, 2009, 08:01:03 am
Motion fails. dndfreak's turn.

Also, I vote he can play.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 13, 2009, 08:34:20 am
I vote he can't. 
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 13, 2009, 09:35:04 am
I vote he can.

My proposal is to change rule 207 to "All players have a single vote on each proposal except the player that proposed it."

Of course, I vote yes.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 13, 2009, 10:44:39 am
I vote nay, balance of power and all that. Also, I don't know if we can let Detoxicated vote yet. He has a majority, but votes are still pending.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 13, 2009, 10:45:35 am
I don't understand.  Are you saying people who make the proposal can't vote?

I vote nay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on September 13, 2009, 12:24:44 pm
I think so. Nay in that case.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 13, 2009, 12:57:40 pm
Yes, I am saying that people can't vote on their own proposals.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 13, 2009, 08:30:42 pm
I'd like to suggest a slight change to the bill.  Make it so that the bill only applies when there are an even number of players, to avoid ties.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 13, 2009, 09:28:19 pm
I'd like to suggest a slight change to the bill.  Make it so that the bill only applies when there are an even number of players, to avoid ties.

Umm... As it is now, a proposal isn't passed on a tie (you need a majority).  Unless the proposer votes no for his own proposal, your idea wouldn't have any impact on play whatsoever.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 14, 2009, 08:14:55 am
so you're voting on your own proposal that says people can't vote on their proposals? how delightfully ironic yet necessary. also, nay, you should be allowed to vote for your stuff.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 14, 2009, 09:13:54 am
I've re-read rule #304, and rule #105, and have decided to add Detoxicated to the roster. That means we need your vote on this rule-change, Detoxicated.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Grangan on September 15, 2009, 08:03:39 pm
yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 17, 2009, 06:27:08 am
If Kenotai and detox would be so kind as to vote..
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on September 17, 2009, 04:31:26 pm
Nay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 18, 2009, 04:04:47 am
Well, the motion failed, but we still need Detox's vote for proper scoring.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 18, 2009, 04:55:36 am
Well, the motion failed, but we still need Detox's vote for proper scoring.

I've PM'd him. All we can do is wait...
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Detoxicated on September 18, 2009, 10:38:01 am
I vote nay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 21, 2009, 06:40:01 am
Fellow players, I deeply apologise for the hypocrisy I just displayed. I meant to update sooner, but there was this party, and... yeah, sorry.

Anyway, motion failed, points and rules updated, kenobro's turn!
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 25, 2009, 05:12:40 am
so, according to rule 302. this is kenobro's last day to make a proposal before his turn is skipped.

EDIT:

Depending on where you live, now might be a good time to agree it's Detox's turn.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 27, 2009, 11:15:52 am
...am I the only one still interested in playing?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 27, 2009, 11:16:45 am
Burrito has a life, and double posting in this thread isn't going to gen an update any sooner.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 27, 2009, 11:37:05 am
Oh, I forgot about that! Yes, detox's turn! OP updated.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 27, 2009, 12:11:36 pm
Burrito has a life, and double posting in this thread isn't going to gen an update any sooner.

I only double posted because it's been like two days since the last post, and what do you mean "Burrito has a life"? what does that have to do with this? it wasn't him being inactive, it was you that didn't do anything for 5 days, I don't see how burrito having stuff to do all day a reason for you not to make a rule proposal.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 27, 2009, 12:13:22 pm
That's not what I was talking about.  You were like, begging him to update.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 27, 2009, 12:43:39 pm
I was more like, begging you to do something in your turn.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 27, 2009, 12:44:25 pm
I was referring to when you double posted.  :-\
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Detoxicated on September 28, 2009, 02:22:50 am
I propose a change to rule 302:
The updated rule shall be: if a player can not complete his turn due to not being active for at least 5 days, his turn is skipped and passed on to the next player in line. Any player who does not manage to post his change-rule in time gets a penalty of -10 points.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 28, 2009, 02:25:38 am
Yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 28, 2009, 07:26:10 am
yay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on September 28, 2009, 09:02:43 am
Nay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 28, 2009, 12:26:17 pm
Nay.  People have lives, and not everybody always visits every topic that's been posted in.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on September 28, 2009, 01:40:35 pm
Nay.  People have lives, and not everybody always visits every topic that's been posted in.

You do realise that the time for this to kick in is five days. Really, if you don't check that often, you shouldn't be in the game at all.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on September 28, 2009, 01:42:09 pm
Well, not me particularly.  Plus I've had a lot of homework to do.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on September 30, 2009, 06:30:45 am
Yay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on September 30, 2009, 05:41:43 pm
Took me a while to realize that you were voting and not expressing happiness for the fact that Keno has homework.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 01, 2009, 07:05:03 am
Are you going to vote or not?  Seriously, stop mentioning me in every post.

To be fair I was also slightly confused.  No harmed feelings, m'kay?  :)
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 01, 2009, 07:18:02 am
actually he did vote.

yay

Someone here is jumping the accusation wagon a bit too soon.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on October 01, 2009, 03:45:23 pm
Never put a nice gesture next to
m'kay?

Makes you sound like a stranger danger.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 01, 2009, 04:24:36 pm
Umm, grangan is going to get himself banned apparently.  So what's going to happen to this game when he leaves?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 01, 2009, 05:25:31 pm
he would just be removed from the player list, I don't exactly see the issue.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on October 01, 2009, 08:37:47 pm
I think Keno wants to know if his vote will count for this round.

Although he has yet to vote, so I'm with putz on this one.  What's the problem?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 02, 2009, 05:45:42 am
Nothing, sheesh.  I did vote.  I think I voted like, second.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 02, 2009, 06:12:05 am
I think he meant you meant Grangan's vote..I'm getting awfully confused here.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 02, 2009, 06:13:28 am
Yeah, ウィll* Grangan's vote count?


*My language is stuck on Japanese for some reason.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 02, 2009, 06:53:42 am
Which is ironic, because you wrote that in Engilsh.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 02, 2009, 06:55:16 am
Only some vowels do it.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 02, 2009, 07:02:44 am
yet that message had a,u,i,o and e in it. >_>
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on October 02, 2009, 12:31:23 pm
I realized I haven't voted yet.

Nay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 02, 2009, 12:32:18 pm
yet that message had a,u,i,o and e in it. >_>

Certain vowel combos.  It's hard to explain.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on October 02, 2009, 12:35:33 pm
No, it has to do with capitalization and punctuation use.  You capitilized "yeah", then had a comma, the capitalized Grangan.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 03, 2009, 01:28:47 pm
I think Detox didn't notice he didn't vote on his own proposal, so yeah, he should.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Detoxicated on October 06, 2009, 06:21:17 am
i say yay, but i thought i voted
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 06, 2009, 08:26:03 am
Nope, so, do we still need Grangan's vote?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 06, 2009, 11:48:26 am
He voted.  He hasn't been banned.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 06, 2009, 01:04:49 pm
no he hasn't voted, and considering how he keeps trying to get himself banned, I don't think he's really in the participating mood.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 06, 2009, 01:06:46 pm
Oh.  I thought he did, maybe I'm thinking of the previous proposal.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 11, 2009, 07:55:37 am
Grangan's been inactive for like a week now, I think it's reasonable to assume we won't be getting his vote anytime soon.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 11, 2009, 07:56:22 am
Agreed.

Let's just wait until Burrito shows up.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on October 11, 2009, 01:57:06 pm
Technically, well... I do have the power to remove him. So I will. Motion passes, rules and points updated.

Take it away... Me?! Oh, right....

---
Rule change proposal #308: Rule #105 becomes mutable
---

I vote yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on October 11, 2009, 02:00:06 pm
yay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on October 11, 2009, 02:13:32 pm
Nay.

I don't want people to have the power to ban others from voting.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 11, 2009, 02:25:57 pm
Completely unrelated to the subject at hand:

307. if a player can not complete his turn due to not being active for at least 5 days, his turn is skipped and passed on to the next player in line. Any player who does not manage to post his change-rule in time gets a penalty of -10 points.

Shouldn't this be rule-change and not change-rule?

Edit: also, I vote Nay on proposal 308.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenotai on October 11, 2009, 02:29:02 pm
Nay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on October 11, 2009, 02:46:45 pm
So you guys want us to have to wait for days until someone posts?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 11, 2009, 02:47:20 pm
Wait, what?

Anyway, Yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on October 11, 2009, 02:53:46 pm
Quote
105* Every player is an eligible voter. Every eligible voter must participate in every vote on rule-changes.
This means we cannot continue until everyone has voted.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 11, 2009, 02:54:19 pm
Oh.  Then I definitely vote Yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on October 11, 2009, 02:56:16 pm
No, it doesn't.

307. if a player can not complete his turn due to not being active for at least 5 days, his turn is skipped and passed on to the next player in line. Any player who does not manage to post his change-rule in time gets a penalty of -10 points.

It's a maximum of five days, also at a penalty.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 11, 2009, 02:58:04 pm
That applies to rule making, not voting.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on October 11, 2009, 03:01:26 pm
Yeah we have no anti-lazing with the votes.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Detoxicated on October 11, 2009, 03:01:38 pm
Yay i vote yay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on October 11, 2009, 04:21:36 pm
Wow, did that really only take an hour?!

Well, motion passed! Take it away putspooza!
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 12, 2009, 08:55:29 am
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309. I propose to change rule 308 to read the following: "Every player is an eligible voter. Every eligible voter must participate in every vote on rule-changes. If a period of 8 days has passed and not all voters have voted, the remaining voters' votes will be ignored and the they will lose 5 points each."
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If you think I could have worded it better or if you think it would be a better proposal if some detail was changed, let me know.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Detoxicated on October 12, 2009, 08:57:34 am
I personally think it should be 7 days but yay, maybe reconsider your idea and reshape it
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 12, 2009, 08:59:53 am
If we reach the point where people take more than 12 days to vote I would probably propose an amendment, but for now I think it's okay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on October 12, 2009, 12:09:44 pm
I think it should be five, seeing as it would be consistent with the no turn takey rule.  But whatever, yay for now.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 12, 2009, 12:57:04 pm
fine I'm going to take it down to 8 days, is that okay with everyone? M'kay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on October 12, 2009, 01:01:10 pm
Aye, I guess.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Kenobro on October 12, 2009, 01:01:54 pm
Yay.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 20, 2009, 05:40:18 am
So, ummm yeah. Nay. >_>
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Quantum Burrito on October 20, 2009, 09:52:13 am
yay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Detoxicated on October 22, 2009, 09:44:19 am
yay
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: dndfreak on October 22, 2009, 09:46:07 am
Again, yay.  That everyone?
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Putspooza on October 22, 2009, 01:09:13 pm
Kenotai's left, but seriously, he can only log on 15 minutes each week, I say he should be dropped from the player list.
Title: Re: Forum Nomic
Post by: Yannick on October 22, 2009, 02:08:54 pm
I am pulling out of this game.