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Will Wright's Spore => Spore: General => Topic started by: DarkSkies on June 03, 2008, 01:17:38 pm

Title: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkSkies on June 03, 2008, 01:17:38 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0lRFIrYQwg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0lRFIrYQwg)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 01:19:19 pm
FIRST!

Thanks  ;D
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gooey Kablooie on June 03, 2008, 01:20:05 pm
Wasn't this on Spaceoddity's blog awhile ago?
(by awhile I mean within two hours)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Xenomorph on June 03, 2008, 01:21:58 pm
Aah, nice movie! thanks Darkskies!
 ;D
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 01:22:48 pm
The guy starts talking about asymmetry but I couldn't understand what he was trying to say. I guess that the line "we HAD assymetrical" means they no longer do. :|
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: martyk on June 03, 2008, 01:23:24 pm
Already posted in the new video index by yours truly, so HA!
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 03, 2008, 01:23:51 pm
Yeah cool flick, but as a heads-up it is already linking in the "New Spore video index" thread and has a discusion going on it. ;)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: The_Kev on June 03, 2008, 01:25:37 pm
Very cool! I like the horns and the wings  ;D
Ahh, we've so long waited for all these videos... :D
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Lurker28 on June 03, 2008, 01:44:50 pm
asymmetry is officially out
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gorman Conall on June 03, 2008, 01:52:54 pm
asymmetry is officially out

He didn't say that.

I believe he was talking about how symmetry is on by default to be more user friendly.

He then started talking about asymmetry and how player could make whatever they want but got side tracked when that guy accidentally removed the head of the creature.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 01:54:01 pm
asymmetry is officially out

Not necessarily, I have an idea on how to flip the axis to allow assymetric creatures, the only 2 problems are that you won't have complete control over the spine and you'll have to design each side of the creature by yourself and of course we don't know how it  will animate but I'll try to make a drawing to explain my idea.

EDIT:
(http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/6650/examplezv3.jpg)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DoggySpew on June 03, 2008, 01:55:33 pm
There is a undo fuction !
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Ciddler on June 03, 2008, 01:58:10 pm
There is a undo fuction !

Yeeah he accidentily removed the head and *poof* it was back on! Very good to see.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: ballistic waffles on June 03, 2008, 02:01:07 pm
i liked how the wings looked, although that one pair of wings is the only pair i've seen seen :(.
and finally somebody made a dragon! :P :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DoggySpew on June 03, 2008, 02:02:25 pm
What I do not like is the imagination of the guy. Put those legs on a different place for peets sake. Experiment with the position of the eyes. That creature sucked. Much too standard.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gorman Conall on June 03, 2008, 02:05:53 pm
That creature sucked. Much too standard.

I wish you guys would stop that.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 02:08:11 pm
That creature sucked. Much too standard.

I wish you guys would stop that.

It's true though, I'm tired of seeing 2 legged, 2 armed creatures too <_<
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 03, 2008, 02:14:05 pm
That creature sucked. Much too standard.

I wish you guys would stop that.

It's true though, I'm tired of seeing 2 legged, 2 armed creatures too <_<

Does not mean they suck.

For all we know the devs are telling them to not use certain parts as well...who knows.  Eveyone's creation is their own and cool in some way.  If people's attitudes will be like "That sucks" I fear for the Sporepedia comunity. :(
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DoggySpew on June 03, 2008, 02:14:20 pm
That creature sucked. Much too standard.

I wish you guys would stop that.

It's true though, I'm tired of seeing 2 legged, 2 armed creatures too <_<

It's not only that, but the whole creature has a Dinosaur stance. Two leggedness is fine, two armed is fine, but they are not even trying to make the configuration unique.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Sasha on June 03, 2008, 02:17:20 pm
He was perharps short on time?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 02:18:19 pm
I've seen videos of people on the CC creating more original stuff under less time. I didn't say the creature sucked though, just that I'm tired of seeing the same arm and leg configurations.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 03, 2008, 02:19:19 pm
And under the gun?

As I posted in the thread that first reported this new footage, it seems all those choosen to demo the game left their wish-lists of what they would do with the game in their other pants.

Give it time, in two weeks we will have more YouTube videos then we can shake a stick at! ;)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Doomsday on June 03, 2008, 02:26:27 pm
I just thought it was ugly. It started out good with the Whale-like mouth and the Sauropod/Nessie body structure, but quickly degenerated into suckitude. Oh well it's a new video, so I'm happy.

I can barely make out what he is saying about Asymmetry but I'll take a shot at it:

"The interesting thing about the creature editor is that to make it user friendly, it's all based on symmetry. So the spine is the line of symmetry. So basically any part you put on the spine, any leg or arm, will be mirror on the sides or join out the front or back. We found... The reason we had it at asymmetrical is so you could do sort of what you wanted and put one leg on.." *gets interrupted because the player did something stupid*
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 02:28:33 pm
Yeah, let's hope it's still in.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: JakeCourtney on June 03, 2008, 03:26:42 pm
Another lack-luster video showing some nice limitations.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Doomsday on June 03, 2008, 03:32:21 pm
Another lack-luster video showing some nice limitations.

Geez. You make me look like a Slap-Happy Optimist. If you are going to continue being this negative, just shut up please?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Skraeling on June 03, 2008, 03:33:13 pm
Another lack-luster video showing some nice limitations.

so then...

1. stop posting.
2. stop watching videos that are posted.
3. do step 1 & 2 in whatever order you prefer.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Holiace on June 03, 2008, 03:35:16 pm
Another lack-luster video showing some nice limitations.

What limitations?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Veraal on June 03, 2008, 03:37:13 pm
Boobs and explosions, probably.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Enoch on June 03, 2008, 03:40:08 pm
I did like the eye on the tip of the nose.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Doomsday on June 03, 2008, 03:40:48 pm
I did like the eye on the tip of the nose.

It was a nose. It was in the Sensory category.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: SporeGames on June 03, 2008, 03:45:13 pm
Another lack-luster video showing some nice limitations.

Blasphemy!
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Anony on June 03, 2008, 04:19:58 pm
...who knows.  Eveyone's creation is their own and cool in some way.  If people's attitudes will be like "That sucks" I fear for the Sporepedia comunity. :(

Not to be argumentative, but I'd be far more concerned for the sporepedia comunity if people adopted the "everything is special, yay!" approach that your suggesting.  I'd like to see things that are unique and best represent the potential of the game engine get the high praise.  I'm hoping "decent" work that is cliche / unoriginal sinks to the bottom.

I want some videos that better showcase the game's potential... but we're only 2 weeks away from messing around on our own so I'm going to wait patiently.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 04:23:54 pm
@JakeCourtney - Every single post you make you make a comment on how crappy the game or the editor are because of x or because of y, seriously either stop doing that or go away, you're looking more and more like a troll who comes here just to diss people by saying that a game they've been waiting for for years is gonna suck in every aspect. Let me put it nice and clear, if you don't like it, say it all at once and then shut up forever about how the game looks so bad to you.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: JakeCourtney on June 03, 2008, 04:59:08 pm
I'll probably just carry on what I've been doing, but thanks for your concern.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 05:00:24 pm
I'll probably just carry on what I've been doing, but thanks for your concern.

I'm not concerned at all, if you carry on the moderators will notice what you're doing and then you're their problem, not ours.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: JakeCourtney on June 03, 2008, 05:09:32 pm
Considering I'm not doing anything wrong.  Simply voicing my opinion from a view point of pessimist.  It's a problem that most of you guys are Sims fans, so your more than likely soft.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 03, 2008, 05:13:20 pm
Considering I'm not doing anything wrong.  Simply voicing my opinion from a view point of pessimist.  It's a problem that most of you guys are Sims fans, so your more than likely soft.

Speaking your opinion is fine, insulting others is not.

Seriously, I know your not interested in making friends, it's the internet for goodness sakes...but be respectful please.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 05:14:07 pm
Actually, I don't play Sims/Sims 2 that much other than for designing houses. What I'm trying to say is that you can't expect people to be friendly when you come on a fan forum just to literally piss people off by "insulting" a game that they've been waiting for a long time. So my question is: if you don't like the game, why are you here?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Hydromancerx on June 03, 2008, 05:16:22 pm
I tell ya everyone is making humans or dragons ... *big sigh*
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 05:17:44 pm
Hydro has spoken, I was right.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: gec05 on June 03, 2008, 05:24:35 pm
Well not everyone is as creative as you Hydro. Just let them do what they like, at least it isn't a giant penis.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 05:26:41 pm
Would have been more interesting and funnier too, imagine if that guy had the guts to make a penis creature xD
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Lurker28 on June 03, 2008, 05:28:02 pm
Considering I'm not doing anything wrong.  Simply voicing my opinion from a view point of pessimist.  It's a problem that most of you guys are Sims fans, so your more than likely soft.

I do agree that Jakes perspective is no worse then those people who believe spore will take out their damn trash for them and have their children. Is just on the literal opposite spectrum as those people.

I fall in between, but I am more spore fan boy then moderate...I believe that spore is going to be a revolutionary change. I have a lot of history making games (currently working on a game similar to that of sins of solar empire....just in our spare time), and in my eyes from that perspective I think it will be amazing.

However, I know that the Sims was a great step in the right direction for gaming as a social medium....I hated it, I could not stand the game at all. This does not mean I do not appreciate what the Sims franchise has done for gaming, it just means it is not the type of game play I find extremely appealing. All in all, Jake is just voicing his overly pessimistic opinion like the over optimistic fanboys on these forums. They are pretty much two sides of the same coin.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Doomsday on June 03, 2008, 05:28:47 pm
Would have been more interesting and funnier too, imagine if that guy had the guts to make a penis creature xD

Flaccid or Rigid? I suppose it would take more guts to create a flaccid penis creature. You could call them the Sinep.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 03, 2008, 05:29:54 pm
Well not everyone is as creative as you Hydro. Just let them do what they like, at least it isn't a giant penis.

*quickly moves to block his monitor and half-finished giant penis from view*

Ummm yeah!  That would suck.   :-[
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 03, 2008, 05:30:13 pm
Would have been more interesting and funnier too, imagine if that guy had the guts to make a penis creature xD

Flaccid or Rigid? I suppose it would take more guts to create a flaccid penis creature. You could call them the Sinep.

hey! I made one in gmod and then smacked the server admin with it  :D
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: google_video_fan on June 03, 2008, 06:07:35 pm
i bet he was expecting it would fly...
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Hydromancerx on June 03, 2008, 09:05:10 pm
Well not everyone is as creative as you Hydro. Just let them do what they like, at least it isn't a giant penis.

I don't know why not :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: happydan20 on June 03, 2008, 09:50:27 pm
the video is no longer available on youtube, and i was late to the party, is there another place to view it?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Interitus on June 03, 2008, 10:05:05 pm
the video is no longer available on youtube, and i was late to the party, is there another place to view it?

It works for me, try again.

It reminds me of the IGN demo, he tried to make a dragon too  :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: JakeCourtney on June 03, 2008, 10:09:44 pm
the video is no longer available on youtube, and i was late to the party, is there another place to view it?

I know.  It's like they are purposely trying to find the worse people to have test out the editor.  Hmm... What should I make... I know the same thing everyone else has made. 
It works for me, try again.

It reminds me of the IGN demo, he tried to make a dragon too  :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: happydan20 on June 03, 2008, 11:51:41 pm
thats weird it works now, before it was blacked out and said that it was no longer available for some reason.

I understand everyones desire for new more exciting demos, but i think we have to realize something will has joked about.  Most of what people make are going to be crap, its quantity not quality.  He was asked something like, "so this is really intelligent design?"  "Yeah its like a bunch of gods designing things, i don't know about intelligent though"

as far as the symmetry debate: to me he was stating there was a lot of discussion on how many and what shortcuts they put into the interface.  The guy was sort of cut off in his explanation but i don't think asymmetrical is out, its just not the default build option.

Also at the very end he mentioned "if you give it a pig mouth it'll sound like a pig." 

I hadn't yet heard on what determined the sound the creatures make.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: skewedjester on June 04, 2008, 03:24:13 am
Also at the very end he mentioned "if you give it a pig mouth it'll sound like a pig." 

I hadn't yet heard on what determined the sound the creatures make.

Oh, yeah, I've seen the acoustic effect of a mouth in a previous video. Forgot which one, exactly, but it was a vaguely monkey-ish creature, and I think it had two buzzsaws on its shoulders and kind of a cone head. Anyway, it had a monkey/ape mouth, and it sounded just like a chimp.

Adding more than one mouth should make for some interesting blended vocalizations...
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Amazingchi on June 04, 2008, 03:26:49 am
The title of this thread threw me a bit, I thought there was a new version of the Creature Creator xD!

I watched this vid in the index thread. I like the fact the guy using it actually thought about what he was doing.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 04, 2008, 08:15:14 am
as far as the symmetry debate: to me he was stating there was a lot of discussion on how many and what shortcuts they put into the interface.  The guy was sort of cut off in his explanation but i don't think asymmetrical is out, its just not the default build option.

A while ago I had an idea on why people couldn't see any checkbox to turn off symmetry, if they didn't remove it they probably made it work like for example: you press CTRL while placing the part so it's only placed on the side you want it to instead of both.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Crowster on June 04, 2008, 09:05:29 am
As much as I'm sure everyone wants asymmetrical creatures, after watching that video, I really don't think it's going to happen.

Everything said about asymmetry, the best I could hear it ...

To make it user friendly, it's all based on symmetry. The spine is the line of symmetry, so any part that you put on, any leg or arm, will mirror on the sides, or will join up on the front or the back ... originally we had it asymmetrical so you could do sort of what you wanted, and put just one leg on if ...

*The guy rips the face off his creature. Uses CTRL + Z. A tangent on keyboard shortcuts ensues, and discussion on symmetry ends*


I've always assumed that, if asymmetry was possible, it would be shift + click/drag/position, or something like that. He said in there that it was to make it more user friendly, and not due to some weird technical or animation error, so it's still possible that it's in there as a keyboard shortcut for those who know how to access it, but ... there is nothing in what he said that would point to it still being in there. We've had screenshots of asymmetrical creatures, so we know it WAS in there, but ... line for line, it really doesn't sound good.

It doesn't bother me too much. With a few exceptions (http://www.totalfisherman.com/flounder.jpg), most every creature on earth is symmetrical. Any new limitation that they put on the editor is going to stink, but I can live with forced symmetry.

Despite all this ... the very first thing I'm going to do when I get my hands on the editor is to see what the shift key does. You never know. >_>
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkSkies on June 04, 2008, 09:08:52 am
how about some examples of those asymetrical creatures you were talking about
so far I dont remember any
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 04, 2008, 09:09:52 am
I'm gonna see what every key and key combination does  ;D
Or just read the manual  ;)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkSkies on June 04, 2008, 09:18:13 am
I have a bad feeling that most of the ppl on here are going to be really disappointed with creature creator. So far I havent seen any creature that stood out from the rest of the pack as far as complex designing. The three factors I've seen that will be limiting the creatures are:
A) 20 segments on the spine
B) No split spline feature (May have a work-around using tentacles)
C) Symmetrical features
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Lippy on June 04, 2008, 09:45:02 am
People complain about the dragons.  People complain about the weird Eurogamer creatures.  Just think how Alex feels watching the hundreds of them with every demo he gives to the unimaginative adults who are just unable to make something "different."

I think that even with the "limitations" there's still a HUGE amount of variety available to those of us who have the creativity, ingenuity, and imagination to work with what we've got will be more than capable of dealing with them. 

In two weeks we'll have more than enough creatures to comment on how dull and unimaginative they are, and how ours are oh so much better.  ;D
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Crowster on June 04, 2008, 09:48:13 am
http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_32_big.jpg (http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_32_big.jpg)

Asymmetrical creature. All it proves, though, is that asymmetry was once possible. Judging from what the guy said in the video, that is likely no longer the case.

Quote from: DarkSkies
I have a bad feeling that most of the ppl on here are going to be really disappointed with creature creator. So far I havent seen any creature that stood out from the rest of the pack as far as complex designing. The three factors I've seen that will be limiting the creatures are:
A) 20 segments on the spine
B) No split spline feature (May have a work-around using tentacles)
C) Symmetrical features

People will be disappointed. No doubt about that. There will always be a percentage of people who will be disappointed. I'm not worried about "complex designs," personally. Partially because most people demoing the editor simply haven't put much thought into the design the way some of us have been for 3 and a half years. Also, making a good creature shouldn't always be about complexity. Being creative with what you've got, and having an eye for what is and isn't aesthetically pleasing is a lot more interesting to me, personally. There IS beauty in simplicity.

A) I was a bit disappointed with only 20 vertebrae. Still, I don't know what's stopping someone from making the body thinner, therefore making it look longer, and then cranking the size up a bit. Instant longer creature with only 20 vertebrae (unless we don't have control over the creature's size).

B) Honestly was NEVER expecting a split spine. Nowhere have I ever seen it, or seen any evidence for it. Tentacles don't appear to be possible, though, at least not tentacles like I was hoping for. It looks like you can fashion a limb to look like a tentacle, but I don't know about making it grasp or function like a real tentacle. We've got the part in the accessories, but that's probably just for show / stats.

C) Somewhat restrictive. It's kind of a letdown, but not a deal breaker for me. Might be for some people, but when I look through my sketches of imagined creatures, not a single one is asymmetrical. It's the kind of thing that you want just so you can feel like you have more freedom, but will rarely use. I don't know if I'd EVER use it, personally, but that's just me.

EDIT: Edited the picture to a URL. Didn't realize it was so big.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkSkies on June 04, 2008, 09:55:19 am
From what I can tell that pic you posted is still symmetrical, evenly placed arms and legs. If the part you are talking about is the weapon on the arm? Thats not what asymmetrical is.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 04, 2008, 09:57:34 am
From what I can tell that pic you posted is still symmetrical, evenly placed arms and legs. If the part you are talking about is the weapon on the arm? Thats not what asymmetrical is.

The weapon part on its back is part of the creature, not an actual weapon, just for looks, it also has a hand on one side and a weapon on the other so it is assymetrical.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Crowster on June 04, 2008, 10:00:55 am
From what I can tell that pic you posted is still symmetrical, evenly placed arms and legs. If the part you are talking about is the weapon on the arm? Thats not what asymmetrical is.

a·sym·met·ric   
–adjective
1.   not identical on both sides of a central line; unsymmetrical; lacking symmetry: Most faces are asymmetric.


As long as something was put on one side of the creature, and it was not mirrored on the other side, that is asymmetry, by definition. If you're just talking about limb configuration ... the limbs are nothing more than other parts. If he was able to put a weapon on one side and not have it mirrored on the other, there would be nothing stopping him from doing the same with a leg or an arm.

Don't really need graphic evidence, however. The video already confirmed that, at one point, asymmetry was possible, and that, in one form or another, they "took it out."
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 04, 2008, 10:03:58 am
From what I can tell that pic you posted is still symmetrical, evenly placed arms and legs. If the part you are talking about is the weapon on the arm? Thats not what asymmetrical is.

The weapon part on its back is part of the creature, not an actual weapon, just for looks, it also has a hand on one side and a weapon on the other so it is assymetrical.

The hand is most defiantly asymmetrical, but I believe the thing on its back is its tail sticking up...could be wrong but the angle is hard to tell either way.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 04, 2008, 10:13:05 am
You can still make asymmetrical creatures to a certain extent (even if they took it out), almost every earth creature is symmetrical on one axis but asymmetrical on the other, so just take advantage of that in the editor:

(http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/recreation_2_big.jpg)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 04, 2008, 10:15:55 am
You can still make asymmetrical creatures to a certain extent (even if they took it out), almost every earth creature is symmetrical on one axis but asymmetrical on the other, so just take advantage of that in the editor:

This picture is the most recent asymmetrical one I can think of...hummm.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Doomsday on June 04, 2008, 10:26:09 am
You can still make asymmetrical creatures to a certain extent (even if they took it out), almost every earth creature is symmetrical on one axis but asymmetrical on the other, so just take advantage of that in the editor:

This picture is the most recent asymmetrical one I can think of...hummm.

Well... It's hard to tell with that one. It's not completely asymmetrical, but it's not symmetrical either. It has an odd symmetry to it. The only really weird part is determining whether to consider the rear facing foot as being asymmetrical or not. Everything else is symmetrical, and depend on your view of if that one foot represents Customizable Player-induced asymmetry or is a function of the Symmetrical Features inherent in the editor.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Bona Fide Supraman on June 04, 2008, 10:32:18 am
2 quick questions, that I'm sure all of you can easily answer:

- when is the creature creator being released?

- where can you get it from in Europe?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Doomsday on June 04, 2008, 10:36:19 am
2 quick questions, that I'm sure all of you can easily answer:

- when is the creature creator being released?

- where can you get it from in Europe?

June 17th.

Only through Online means, as far as I'm aware.

There are 10 threads with this information. Search function is there for a reason.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Bona Fide Supraman on June 04, 2008, 10:39:28 am
2 quick questions, that I'm sure all of you can easily answer:

- when is the creature creator being released?

- where can you get it from in Europe?

June 17th.

Only through Online means, as far as I'm aware.

There are 10 threads with this information. Search function is there for a reason.

I know, but to be frank, I couldn't be bothered.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: uj on June 04, 2008, 10:41:29 am
You can still make asymmetrical creatures to a certain extent (even if they took it out), almost every earth creature is symmetrical on one axis but asymmetrical on the other, so just take advantage of that in the editor.
That's not an asymmetrical creature. It will move forward along it's symmetry axis as opposed to sideways which would have made it an asymmetrical creature.

Another thing, there are no complex limbs. You can only attach a limb to the spine. You can't attach a limb to a limb to a limb... and make a configuration like Buttface in the GDC 2005 video.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 04, 2008, 10:48:23 am
You can still make asymmetrical creatures to a certain extent (even if they took it out), almost every earth creature is symmetrical on one axis but asymmetrical on the other, so just take advantage of that in the editor.
That's not an asymmetrical creature. It will move forward along it's symmetry axis as opposed to sideways which would have made it an asymmetrical creature.

Another thing, there are no complex limbs. You can only attach a limb to the spine. You can't attach a limb to a limb to a limb... and make a configuration like Buttface in the GDC 2005 video.

Where is proof of no limb to limb?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DoggySpew on June 04, 2008, 10:59:56 am
Look guys, we never will hear the end of it, unless someone emails Maxis to make an update for the FAQ section on the official Spore website asking : Can you make assymetrical creatures ?

Since this really IS a frequently asked question, it's a good entry for the FAQ. Then it will end all the discussion about this subject.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Rutilant on June 04, 2008, 11:06:28 am
Oh my goodness. The arms moved.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Lippy on June 04, 2008, 11:15:40 am
Look guys, we never will hear the end of it, unless someone emails Maxis to make an update for the FAQ section on the official Spore website asking : Can you make assymetrical creatures ?

Or until the CC comes out.

That's not an asymmetrical creature. It will move forward along it's symmetry axis as opposed to sideways which would have made it an asymmetrical creature.

You're really stretching it there.  Are you saying that a crab is asymmetrical because it walks sideways, not because one claw is bigger than the other? 
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DoggySpew on June 04, 2008, 11:26:29 am
Look guys, we never will hear the end of it, unless someone emails Maxis to make an update for the FAQ section on the official Spore website asking : Can you make assymetrical creatures ?

Or until the CC comes out.

Quote

Please, we are not that patient.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gorman Conall on June 04, 2008, 11:29:30 am
First off where the hell did you hear that you can not attach limbs to limbs. Oh thats right we haven't. Please do not make stuff up.

Second that video confirmed nothing. He got cut off we could not hear most of he was saying. What we DID hear was that symmetry is the default setting.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Xenomorph on June 04, 2008, 11:31:29 am
Look guys, we never will hear the end of it, unless someone emails Maxis to make an update for the FAQ section on the official Spore website asking : Can you make assymetrical creatures ?

Or until the CC comes out.


Please, we are not that patient.

[removed]
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DoggySpew on June 04, 2008, 11:38:32 am

I've sent an email.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DoggySpew on June 04, 2008, 11:40:15 am
Look guys, we never will hear the end of it, unless someone emails Maxis to make an update for the FAQ section on the official Spore website asking : Can you make assymetrical creatures ?

Since this really IS a frequently asked question, it's a good entry for the FAQ. Then it will end all the discussion about this subject.

Excuse the hot-linked image... but this is a new version of an old asymmetrical design from the Spore site:
*pic*

End of the Debate and de baiting!

Yeah, but they also have this :
(http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_10_big.jpg)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 04, 2008, 12:30:23 pm
Look guys, we never will hear the end of it, unless someone emails Maxis to make an update for the FAQ section on the official Spore website asking : Can you make assymetrical creatures ?

Since this really IS a frequently asked question, it's a good entry for the FAQ. Then it will end all the discussion about this subject.

End of the Debate and de baiting!

Yeah, but they also have this :

Touche!
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: 762 on June 04, 2008, 12:36:11 pm
Touche!

Good sir, it is not necessary, in fact heavily looked down upon, to quote a picture from the post above you. Especially one so large.

In the future, perhaps cut out the picture tags and write *pic* or something to allow everyone to know that you are referring to the picture without cluttering up the page?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 04, 2008, 12:49:12 pm
Touche!

Good sir, it is not necessary, in fact heavily looked down upon, to quote a picture from the post above you. Especially one so large.

In the future, perhaps cut out the picture tags and write *pic* or something to allow everyone to know that you are referring to the picture without cluttering up the page?

Like that? ;)

You notice I did cull the first pic, unfortunately I missed the first. :(  Sorry.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 04, 2008, 01:26:12 pm
You can still make asymmetrical creatures to a certain extent (even if they took it out), almost every earth creature is symmetrical on one axis but asymmetrical on the other, so just take advantage of that in the editor.
That's not an asymmetrical creature. It will move forward along it's symmetry axis as opposed to sideways which would have made it an asymmetrical creature.

Another thing, there are no complex limbs. You can only attach a limb to the spine. You can't attach a limb to a limb to a limb... and make a configuration like Buttface in the GDC 2005 video.

Look at the feet, they seem to be facing "your direction" slightly but it could just be the angle, either way it can be considered asymmetrical if you decide that the legs+feet are symmetrical then the face and that thing on it's chest are asymmetrical.

What proof do you have of no complex limbs? We got a very recent video where you see evidence that it's still in to some extent (the guy grabbed on of the joints and the limb split into 2 half-way accross it).
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Crowster on June 04, 2008, 05:47:10 pm
First off where the hell did you hear that you can not attach limbs to limbs. Oh thats right we haven't. Please do not make stuff up.

Second that video confirmed nothing. He got cut off we could not hear most of he was saying. What we DID hear was that symmetry is the default setting.

The no limb branching thing, it's something I could SEE them taking out, but, to date, there is no reason to believe that they have. It's not something that should be touted as, "Oh it's been taken out no doubt." However, I could see them putting that limitation on due to animation issues. I'd keep my expectations for that one low.

The video confirmed two things. One, asymmetry was once possible, and that, to be more "user friendly" it is now fully symmetrical. I have never seen a creature editor video where things were not mirrored on the other side of the body, even back at GDC 2005, but apparently at one point it did not. Since we know that it was at one point possible, linking this (http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_32_big.jpg) image is pointless.

I'm not saying that asymmetry is 100% confirmed to be removed, I'm just saying that, after watching that video, I wouldn't hold my breath too much. Try not to get your heart set on features that may or may not be there, that's what will lead to disappointment. You can hope that it's there, but if you get yourself to the point where you expect it, and Maxis does not deliver, then June 17th is going to turn from a day of excitement to disappointment.

I'm not saying that it's been taken out for sure. I'm just saying that, trying to put your own spin on what was said because you want asymmetry to still be possible might not be a good idea. People did the same thing when Will Wright stated, "water creatures are on the cusp of being cut out." Back then, there was one camp of people who insisted, "Oh, he's just talking about the underwater CIVILIZATIONS. Cities and stuff. I'm sure you'll still be able to make underwater creatures for the creature stage, just not bring them to tribal until you move to land." It's these people that were the most disappointed when they found out how the transition from cell to creature was going to work.

It's just safer to let yourself get excited about features we know are in there, rather than ones that are iffy.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: wydraz on June 04, 2008, 06:39:58 pm
OMG! WTF!

I couldn't care less if asymmetry or limbs attached to limbs were in or out. There's plenty of things to do with the CC other than worry about that. Get over it, people! Sure, it would be cool, but I can live with it if they weren't IN there. Just wait a few weeks and find out.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 04, 2008, 06:43:33 pm
I won't be sad if asymmetry is not in, I'm just trying to make those people who are saying that branched limbs are out that they are still in fact there, jesus christ just watch this recent video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAHjDUlwEyk

Now you might argue that it split because it's placed in the center, but there's also a recent screenshot of the creature stage where you see creatures with split legs like buttface but I can't be bothered to go search for it.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 04, 2008, 06:48:01 pm
I won't be sad if asymmetry is not in, I'm just trying to make those people who are saying that branched limbs are out that they are still in fact there, jesus christ just watch this recent video:


Now you might argue that it split because it's placed in the center, but there's also a recent screenshot of the creature stage where you see creatures with split legs like buttface but I can't be bothered to go search for it.

Right at 4:00 in...that gives me some sweet ideas for some limb combos. ;)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Null on June 04, 2008, 07:29:45 pm
There is enough recent evidence to make me inclined to agree with crowster on this (very nice posts BTW), but of course we will see firsthand soon enough but at this moment, it sound like asymmetry may be out. Hope not, though.

Quote
you can still make asymmetrical creatures to a certain extent (even if they took it out), almost every earth creature is symmetrical on one axis but asymmetrical on the other, so just take advantage of that in the editor.

Thats called bilateral symmetry if its on one axis, and radial if it is symmetric around a point. There IS no "other axis" with animal life I don't think. There is no X and Y axis in biology I believe. I am not as certain about that as I would like to be so if anyone can prove me wrong I would love to hear it.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 04, 2008, 07:34:22 pm
Thats called bilateral symmetry if its on one axis, and radial if it is symmetric around a point. There IS no "other axis" with animal life.

I didn't know how to explain it, sorry for me to find an alternative that allowed you to still get what I meant and correct me :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Null on June 04, 2008, 07:39:11 pm
 :P Ah...
The point wasn't as much to correct you for the sake of correcting you as it was so you wouldn't need an alternative next time, if that makes sense.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 04, 2008, 07:42:45 pm
Yeah I know, was just kidding though. I wonder how the game will animate creatures like the Twowaysaurus though :o
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: LadyM on June 04, 2008, 08:38:19 pm
Please don't post email addresses. I've removed them.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: uj on June 05, 2008, 10:01:51 pm
Why is it that people think the truth is what they want it to be instead of the facts? Prepare for a big "I told you so" when the editor is out. See my sig.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Doomsday on June 05, 2008, 10:03:04 pm
Why is it that people think the truth is what they want it to be instead of the facts? Prepare for a big "I told you so" when the editor is out. See my sig.

You're already wrong about number 2 though. Split Limbs has been confirmed, and recently too. Like late May, recently.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gorman Conall on June 05, 2008, 10:04:02 pm
Eh might wanna fix number 2 my friend.

Split limbs are actually 100% confirmed with video proof.

Oh and while you are at it. Knock the salt off your shoulder.

Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.

DOH

OpDDay beat me too it.

Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Doomsday on June 05, 2008, 10:24:03 pm
Eh might wanna fix number 2 my friend.

Split limbs are actually 100% confirmed with video proof.

Oh and while you are at it. Knock the salt off your shoulder.

Warning - while you were typing a new reply has been posted. You may wish to review your post.

DOH

OpDDay beat me too it.

What can I say? I studied with Quick Draw McGraw. EL KABONG AWAY!
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gorman Conall on June 05, 2008, 10:27:15 pm
Quick draw mcgraw..now your making me feel old  :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Ryuukuro on June 05, 2008, 11:02:18 pm
<rant>

No gender at all?  It is so depressing that the designers seem to be ignoring the most interesting aspects of life in favor of what they think makes easy-breezy gameplay.  Am I still buying Spore?  Hell, yeah!  I'll have it on launch day, but little by little I can't help but see one missed opportunity after another...and I'm not looking forward to buying EP after EP to explore possibilities that I would want from the get go.  Sure, they probably didn't have time to put all of that in or they might have very clear reasons for not putting it in at all but I just keep feeling like the game is getting shallow.  It can't rely on the creativity of others to give it depth.  I would hope that the game would be full and fascinating on its own without the collecting part.

</rant> 
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Josasa on June 05, 2008, 11:47:16 pm
<rant>

No gender at all?  It is so depressing that the designers seem to be ignoring the most interesting aspects of life in favor of what they think makes easy-breezy gameplay.  Am I still buying Spore?  Hell, yeah!  I'll have it on launch day, but little by little I can't help but see one missed opportunity after another...and I'm not looking forward to buying EP after EP to explore possibilities that I would want from the get go.  Sure, they probably didn't have time to put all of that in or they might have very clear reasons for not putting it in at all but I just keep feeling like the game is getting shallow.  It can't rely on the creativity of others to give it depth.  I would hope that the game would be full and fascinating on its own without the collecting part.

</rant> 

One of the most amazing games is about to come out and all you can do is get pissed about something minor that's not going to be in the game? Shame, shame...
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gorman Conall on June 05, 2008, 11:53:34 pm
I do not see the issue. There were really no genders back in 05....you can't really be mad at them removing a feature that was never there nor ever promised to be there.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: creiij on June 06, 2008, 12:29:04 am
It's better to be genderless than to winning a big fight and realizing that all you have left of all your nearby creatures is two guys =(
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 06, 2008, 04:19:30 am
It's better to be genderless than to winning a big fight and realizing that all you have left of all your nearby creatures is two guys =(


LMAO!  Very good point!  Might be why they decided to never go that way.  Besides there is nothing keeping you from pretending there are males and females.

I mean, how many of you can tell the sex of a turtle, a cat, a bluejay, an aligator...

...from 50 paces?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: wydraz on June 06, 2008, 04:46:42 am
Gender is an evolutionary option on Earth. It happened here, but doesn't necessarily have to happen enywhere else. There are still creatures on Earth that have no gender, such as the snail. Any two snails can mate. (Technically they are hermaphrodites, being both sexes at once). Some creatures just divide in two. Others bud. Go figure.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: uj on June 06, 2008, 08:04:50 am
Eh might wanna fix number 2 my friend.

Split limbs are actually 100% confirmed with video proof.
I have clarified #2 in my sig. Prepare for a big "I told you so" on June 17th. Either that or me admitting I was wrong. Should be a fun day.

Quote
Oh and while you are at it. Knock the salt off your shoulder.
I'm afraid I'm not familiar with that expression.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 06, 2008, 08:16:37 am
We've seen screenshots of limbs with 5 segments and I haven't seen any of those in the list so it must 2 limbs together, just add another one and then split them.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: CosmicD on June 06, 2008, 08:44:12 am
hmm? wasnt there that one creature that looked a bit like a stretched pumpkin, and they put a limb on his head, and then they pick the last joint and it suddenly has a junkction.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 06, 2008, 08:56:09 am
Yes, but the limb was in the center of the creature, that's why it split. We don't know if we can split them when they are on the sides or if we can put limbs on other limbs, although the evidence we have so far points towards a yes.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: uj on June 06, 2008, 09:22:02 am
Yes, but the limb was in the center of the creature, that's why it split. We don't know if we can split them when they are on the sides or if we can put limbs on other limbs, although the evidence we have so far points towards a no.
Fixed.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 06, 2008, 10:10:07 am
Yes, but the limb was in the center of the creature, that's why it split. We don't know if we can split them when they are on the sides or if we can put limbs on other limbs, although the evidence we have so far points towards a yes.
Fixed.

Unfixed, reasons:

1. Screenshot with a creature that has a limb with 5 segments (none of the standart limbs do).
2. Recent in-game screenshot of a creature with split legs (like buttface).
3. Very Recent video of a limb being split into 2 half-way accross it.

Hope that clears it up.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gorman Conall on June 06, 2008, 10:45:07 am
UJ arrogance will almost always come back to bite you..
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 06, 2008, 10:47:41 am
A lot of peoples arrogance comes back to me, but someone has to keep the facepalm rate low on the forums :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkSkies on June 06, 2008, 11:42:26 am
I'd imagine that once CC is out and/or the full game is out, there will be mods like editing the ini to increase the number of vertabre, add custom parts, etc.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Beatnuki on June 06, 2008, 11:53:53 am
I hadn't given much thought to modding.....

Cybernetic implant creature parts mod? Yes please!
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: wydraz on June 06, 2008, 11:59:43 am
It's been mentioned before, but modding won't work if you want to share what you make. The sporepedia checks the validity of shared creations, and rejects them if they are "tweaked".
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkSkies on June 06, 2008, 01:36:33 pm
Is it just me or does all the arms and legs have 4 joints?
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: google_video_fan on June 06, 2008, 01:45:35 pm
Is it just me or does all the arms and legs have 4 joints?

According to this image, the higher your brain level, the more access you have to limbs with more joints:

(http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/5223/limbsgo1.png)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: JakeCourtney on June 06, 2008, 01:46:30 pm
How is the size of the creature controlled?  Is it relative to the size of the creature blob in the editor or is there some type of slider or selector?

Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 06, 2008, 02:09:32 pm
There is no exact size but you can compare the creature you're making to the trees in the background to have an idea of how big it is.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: WeAreLegion on June 06, 2008, 02:51:09 pm
It's been mentioned before, but modding won't work if you want to share what you make. The sporepedia checks the validity of shared creations, and rejects them if they are "tweaked".

Good.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Hydromancerx on June 06, 2008, 02:52:42 pm
Is it just me or does all the arms and legs have 4 joints?

I was noticing that too. However what if you added a limb to a limb? Would you get more joins in your limbs? Also we have seen that fat elephant thing with the hands on the top of its head that clap. The shoulder and elbow joints merged in that one. I wonder what happens when you merge more than one limb like that.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Fobok on June 06, 2008, 03:04:10 pm
I'm hoping the 4-jointed limbs can be adjusted so it looks like only three.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Gungnir on June 06, 2008, 03:08:32 pm
Well, in a way, people have 4. Hip, knee, ankle, toes. The last join there can probably be dragged down far enough to make it look like an ankle.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: uj on June 06, 2008, 06:54:42 pm
1. Screenshot with a creature that has a limb with 5 segments (none of the standart limbs do).
Show.
Quote
2. Recent in-game screenshot of a creature with split legs (like buttface).
Show.
Quote
3. Very Recent video of a limb being split into 2 half-way accross it.
Irrelevant. He clearly produced that effect from a single limb. I'm saying attaching a limb to a limb is not possible.
Quote
Hope that clears it up.
Nope.

Evidence that you can't attach a limb to a limb:

1) If it were possible surely Maxis would show it off or somebody would try it. Since we don't see that, the probability of it being possible is very low.

2) No glimpses of it on hover over. When someone is placing a new limb, and they are dragging it from the editor, and on the way to the torso the mouse passes over an already placed limb, one would expect a preview of how it would look like if the dragged limb was attached to the limb in place. We get these kinds of glimpses all the time when parts are moved about. But there are no such glimpses with limb on limb.

UJ arrogance will almost always come back to bite you..
What arrogance? I'm making a prediction. If I'm right I'll gloat about it and if I'm wrong I'll admit it. I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is so to speak.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 06, 2008, 07:18:15 pm
1. Screenshot with a creature that has a limb with 5 segments (none of the standart limbs do).
Show.
Quote
2. Recent in-game screenshot of a creature with split legs (like buttface).
Show.
Quote
3. Very Recent video of a limb being split into 2 half-way accross it.
Irrelevant. He clearly produced that effect from a single limb. I'm saying attaching a limb to a limb is not possible.
Quote
Hope that clears it up.
Nope.

Evidence that you can't attach a limb to a limb:

1) If it were possible surely Maxis would show it off or somebody would try it. Since we don't see that, the probability of it being possible is very low.

2) No glimpses of it on hover over. When someone is placing a new limb, and they are dragging it from the editor, and on the way to the torso the mouse passes over an already placed limb, one would expect a preview of how it would look like if the dragged limb was attached to the limb in place. We get these kinds of glimpses all the time when parts are moved about. But there are no such glimpses with limb on limb.

UJ arrogance will almost always come back to bite you..
What arrogance? I'm making a prediction. If I'm right I'll gloat about it and if I'm wrong I'll admit it. I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is so to speak.

5 joints (http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_30_big.jpg)
6 joints (http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_25_big.jpg)
Split limb in the middle (screenshot from the video) (http://images.eurogamer.net/assets/articles//a/5/9/4/1/8/ss_preview_SporeScreen_002.bmp.jpg)
Split limbs (yes, you read it right, 2 legs, one segment that then splits in two with the front split legs having 3 segments and the back ones having 1) (http://www.xspore.com/content/screenshots/16_619.jpg)

This evidence clearly show that there's more than one way to split limbs. Notice I put evidence in bold because there's nothing to argue about there, I'm showing you screenshots, you're showing me wild assumptions, therefore I wont continue debating this until you can provide me evidence that disproves those screenshots.

1. & 2. Responses: Most people who have tried the editor are limited on time and aren't gonna bother with exploring the possibilities, they just make something rather quickly and in any video so far we haven't had the glimpse of it because people just didn't happen to drag a limb directly over another. I bet there's a lot in the editor they don't want us to know about yet, there's an element of surprise involved in this, just because we haven't seen a creature hover we know they can because they told us so, etc.

As I've said before, here is my pokemanz evidence, now show me yours :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Russ1 on June 07, 2008, 03:04:43 am
New video perhaps?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8uLSM44sP4&feature=related

This guy knows how to talk lol.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Xenomorph on June 07, 2008, 03:16:39 am
1. Screenshot with a creature that has a limb with 5 segments (none of the standart limbs do).
Show.
Quote
2. Recent in-game screenshot of a creature with split legs (like buttface).
Show.
Quote
3. Very Recent video of a limb being split into 2 half-way accross it.
Irrelevant. He clearly produced that effect from a single limb. I'm saying attaching a limb to a limb is not possible.
Quote
Hope that clears it up.
Nope.

Evidence that you can't attach a limb to a limb:

1) If it were possible surely Maxis would show it off or somebody would try it. Since we don't see that, the probability of it being possible is very low.

2) No glimpses of it on hover over. When someone is placing a new limb, and they are dragging it from the editor, and on the way to the torso the mouse passes over an already placed limb, one would expect a preview of how it would look like if the dragged limb was attached to the limb in place. We get these kinds of glimpses all the time when parts are moved about. But there are no such glimpses with limb on limb.

UJ arrogance will almost always come back to bite you..
What arrogance? I'm making a prediction. If I'm right I'll gloat about it and if I'm wrong I'll admit it. I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is so to speak.

5 joints (http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_30_big.jpg)
6 joints (http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_25_big.jpg)
Split limb in the middle (screenshot from the video) (http://images.eurogamer.net/assets/articles//a/5/9/4/1/8/ss_preview_SporeScreen_002.bmp.jpg)
Split limbs (yes, you read it right, 2 legs, one segment that then splits in two with the front split legs having 3 segments and the back ones having 1) (http://www.xspore.com/content/screenshots/16_619.jpg)

This evidence clearly show that there's more than one way to split limbs. Notice I put evidence in bold because there's nothing to argue about there, I'm showing you screenshots, you're showing me wild assumptions, therefore I wont continue debating this until you can provide me evidence that disproves those screenshots.

1. & 2. Responses: Most people who have tried the editor are limited on time and aren't gonna bother with exploring the possibilities, they just make something rather quickly and in any video so far we haven't had the glimpse of it because people just didn't happen to drag a limb directly over another. I bet there's a lot in the editor they don't want us to know about yet, there's an element of surprise involved in this, just because we haven't seen a creature hover we know they can because they told us so, etc.

As I've said before, here is my pokemanz evidence, now show me yours :P

(http://www.forums.court-records.net/images/smilies/takethat.gif)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Woulfe on June 07, 2008, 06:25:38 am
New video perhaps?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8uLSM44sP4&feature=related

This guy knows how to talk lol.

This is the funniest video of Spore there is ( well, after Robin Williams trying it out ) It's funny because it's looking at the CC from a newbie's P.O.V. Quote "I've never tried this before" and he does a pretty good job exploring the CC and what it can do in the short time he plays around with it, and he makes a pretty good creature being his first time exposed to the CC.

- W -
* Who should start saving these wonderful videos of all the game magazine folks trying out the CC for the first time to his own YouTube account for future reference *
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: uj on June 07, 2008, 12:59:11 pm
5 joints (http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_30_big.jpg)
(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f230/peetbyte/1.jpg)
Green = limb. Blue = foot. Pulling the joint circled in red off the ground stretches the base of the foot. No limb attached to a limb here.

Quote
6 joints (http://www.spore.com/images/creatures/creature_25_big.jpg)
(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f230/peetbyte/2.jpg)
The saw and it's support is a single piece(weapon 6D in this thread (http://www.gamingsteve.com/blab/index.php?topic=12387.0)). No limb attached to a limb here.

Quote
Split limb in the middle (screenshot from the video) (http://images.eurogamer.net/assets/articles//a/5/9/4/1/8/ss_preview_SporeScreen_002.bmp.jpg)
Alright. Updated my sig so say 'composite limbs' instead of 'split limbs' because of confusion. Yes you can mess around with a single limb and make it 'split' as seen in this  (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAHjDUlwEyk&amp;feature=related)video(4:05). What I'm arguing is that you can't attach a limb to a limb and make a creature like Buttface anymore.
(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f230/peetbyte/3-1.jpg)

Quote
Split limbs (yes, you read it right, 2 legs, one segment that then splits in two with the front split legs having 3 segments and the back ones having 1) (http://www.xspore.com/content/screenshots/16_619.jpg)
That image isn't clear enough to see anything even when I open it in paint and zoom in for careful scrutiny. And keep in mind that limbs clip through each other while moving.

Quote
1. & 2. Responses: Most people who have tried the editor are limited on time and aren't gonna bother with exploring the possibilities, they just make something rather quickly
You make it sound like attaching a limb to a limb would be some kind of complicated procedure. It takes just a second to drag a limb on top of a limb. The fact that we don't have even one example of this means the probability of it being possible is minuscule.

Quote
and in any video so far we haven't had the glimpse of it because people just didn't happen to drag a limb directly over another.
I bolded for emphasis.
From this  (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GAHjDUlwEyk&amp;feature=related)vid frame by frame at around 3:27.
(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f230/peetbyte/4.jpg)
Notice how the arm remains red, as in 'you can't put that there'. On the last frame it's normal colored because the attachment point is over the torso.

Once again with zoom in:
(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f230/peetbyte/5.jpg)
No attaching limbs to other limbs.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 07, 2008, 01:21:18 pm
5 joints - when you attach a foot to a limb the limb gets dragged down and that's not the case with that creature.

6 joints - even if you consider the 6th joint to be part of the weapon, that still leaves 5 joints.

Split limbs image - I think it's clear enough, we're not seeing it on only one creature, it's in all of them... would be a very rare coincidence if they were all clipping at the same time. There are also other pictures of those creatures where it's clearer that it's indeed a split limb.

Bunch of frames - Notice that it isn't being dragged over a joint, it's being dragged in-between 2 joints which makes it impossible to attach since limb to limb attachments can only be done on the joints.

None of your evidence is conclusive, neither is mine so it's pointless to keep discussing this. You have your mind set that they are out, I don't. We'll see soon enough.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Petike on June 07, 2008, 01:22:26 pm
(http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f230/peetbyte/3-1.jpg)

From Chris Hecker's 2008 Siggraph presentation (http://www.chrishecker.com/images/c/cb/Sporeanim-siggraph08.pdf):
(http://spaceoddityblog.planets.gamespy.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/chrisheckerpaper.jpg)


How about admitting your failure?  :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: BBsman5 on June 07, 2008, 01:25:55 pm
OSNAP
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 07, 2008, 01:35:52 pm
*zing*

Thanks petike, here are 3 ways it can probably be used (even if it weren't possible, the 3rd one always is because the editor merges limbs close to each other):

(http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/488/splitkw4.png)
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: uj on June 07, 2008, 01:58:08 pm
Hmmmm. I haven't considered joint to joint only attachability for limbs. I assumed if it's possible then it can be attached anywhere on the mesh like attaching to the torso or attaching decorations to limbs. Brb after I read the presentation thing.

edit: It's most likely possible with joint to joint only attachability for limbs.
I still think it's odd that nobody tried it in a video.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 07, 2008, 02:17:01 pm
From a programmers point of view, it is easier for a script to animate if it knows where the joints are as it doesn't have to calculate where a new joint would be, etc. It is therefore easier to just let people attach limbs on joints instead of anywhere on the limb. We've also seen that when a limb is close enough to another they merge the mesh, so that's another option.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: outlander_biz on June 07, 2008, 03:01:29 pm
From a programmers point of view, it is easier for a script to animate if it knows where the joints are as it doesn't have to calculate where a new joint would be, etc. It is therefore easier to just let people attach limbs on joints instead of anywhere on the limb. We've also seen that when a limb is close enough to another they merge the mesh, so that's another option.

I agree completely.

but for a fix to placing extra limbs anywhere on a limb, simple move the joint to where you want the new limb and then add another limb as an extension, if done properly I'm sure it would look like one limb with another comming out of the side of it.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 07, 2008, 03:05:24 pm
From a programmers point of view, it is easier for a script to animate if it knows where the joints are as it doesn't have to calculate where a new joint would be, etc. It is therefore easier to just let people attach limbs on joints instead of anywhere on the limb. We've also seen that when a limb is close enough to another they merge the mesh, so that's another option.

I agree completely.

but for a fix to placing extra limbs anywhere on a limb, simple move the joint to where you want the new limb and then add another limb as an extension, if done properly I'm sure it would look like one limb with another comming out of the side of it.

Yeah, that's my third option in my examples.
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Lippy on June 07, 2008, 03:06:39 pm
We've also seen that when a limb is close enough to another they merge the mesh, so that's another option.

That's how metaballs work.  If two metaballs are close enough together, they connect and make one mesh.  And since limbs and the body are made with metaballs, if you position say the knee back up into the body, it should make the entire upper leg look like it's attached to the body. I'm not sure how much limitation (if any) you have with moving the limbs back into the body, but it would be nice if you could loop the limbs back into the body to make some very interesting topology on your creatures. 
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: DarkDragon on June 07, 2008, 04:03:10 pm
Yeah, except instead of metaballs they're metaobjects, or maybe a chain of metaballs, either way it works :P
Title: Re: New SPORE Creature Creator - 06/03/08
Post by: Petike on June 08, 2008, 12:42:12 am
I still think it's odd that nobody tried it in a video.
It is not so odd.
We didn't see any tripods either, since 2005 , and everyone started to specuate that they are taken out, until we saw a few new ones in 2008, but simply no one thought of it before.