Author Topic: Space stage IS broken.  (Read 13759 times)

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Offline Yannick

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #60 on: September 16, 2008, 01:05:59 pm »
Space stage is indeed a hate or love situation. And if the other empires hate you, you're in bad luck.




Like, a plane suddenly crashing into your room kind of bad luck.

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Offline Telluric

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #61 on: September 16, 2008, 01:11:45 pm »
I did nothing to provoke other civs in outer space unless "exploring" is considered provoking.

You know, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if exploring is provoking.  We know that doing things even "out of sight" can make people angry (just use the planet buster and the eco's get angry) and in earlier stages, say Creature, go stand in someone's nest who doesn't like you and... they attack.

It seems likely that the empires around yours are random.  You can roll the dice and get lucky, with some traders and other friendlies.  Or you can have bad luck and get warmongers.  It's going to be especially unhappy if you don't want to be a fighter and you get pushed into it by your neighbors.

Honestly, the only thing I've found for me that works is fighting back.  But, don't fight them invading your world.  Go destroy their colonies.  You get upgrades for fighting.  It's much easier to fight there.  And you can probably get some bonus colonies for yourself that will be staging points and new targets for them.  The hostile empires around me seemed to settle down (ie stopped invading my homeworld) when I wiped out a dozen of their colonies... really, it was just a way to buy time.

I am sympathetic to the plight of the beseiged.  I am one.  When you were in Cell, weren't you chased by faster predators relentlessly?  In creature, didn't your little band get served while looking for bone piles?  In tribal, didn't they enemies come and torch your tents?  It's true that in other stages it was a little easier to deal with enemy aggression... my first reaction is to look for ways to deal with it here, even if those ways are unpalatable to you.

The problem I see is that when you get some randomly generate aggressive neighbors, it isn't obvious what you have to do to deal with them.  Don't pick up the phone and answer their requests for money.  If they are only orange, go talk to them - even if they shoot at you.  Bribe them - it will keep them off your back for awhile.  And if it comes to war, take the fight to them by destroying as many of their outermost colonies as you can right away - don't just suffer endless deaths against them on your homeworld.
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Offline Serak

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #62 on: September 16, 2008, 01:29:09 pm »
I agree with Telluric 100%.

The beginning of Space can be, and most likely will be, relentlessly difficult. The best thing to do is to take the fight to them.

Storytime:

So, at last my Septimi have reached space. But what's this? The first Empire I come across freaks out and decides to field test their new weapons on my worlds.

So, after fruitlessly staving off attack after attack after attack and losing two of my colonies, taking them back, losing them again, taking one back and destroying the other I finally decided that enough was enough. I packed up my GSO Buster, charged mah lazor and armed my Proton Missiles and started suicide bombing runs on thier cities.

In minutes I had wiped out and or captured five colonies, plus those that I lost.

In my glory, they offered to surrender. I rejected them and continued my rampage, widdling them down to one final planet which I destroyed in a blaze of glory.

After that some Yellow Empire started poking at me and they swiftly met the same fate.

During that entire war I didn't experience anything more than 3 attacks on my planets, plus the ignorable pirates.

I know some people want to roleplay the peaceful, let's all have a group hug species, but even they need to know how to fight back.

Offline Telluric

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #63 on: September 16, 2008, 01:38:13 pm »
I know some people want to roleplay the peaceful, let's all have a group hug species, but even they need to know how to fight back.

It would be nice if you could deal with enemy aggression in a different way other than fighting.

There are some old games made by Sierra... city building series that went something like Pharaoh, Cleopatra, Zeus, Poseidon, and last was Emperor; Rise of the Middle Kingdom.  I loved those game.  In those, enemy forces would sometimes show up in your town and kick you around.  And you just had to take it.

But, when they had defeated you, they would demand tribute.  So, you had a reprieve really.  You could pay the tribute and hold them off indefinitely (and tribute wasn't always money, sometimes it was goods)... or you could refuse to pay.  After several refusals, they would come and beat you down again.  You could use that time to build an army and fight back or finish the scenario or whatever.

It's a shame that this is not an option here.  Become a vassal state and continue existing.
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Offline WeatherMAN

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #64 on: September 17, 2008, 08:20:45 am »
Easy Mode: Space is a sandbox where other civs won't get uppity and in your face unless *you* provoke them (except Grox, they are always full uppity)

Are you saying this is how Space game on Easy should be or how it currently is?

Those were my suggestions on how space stage *should* be (IMHO of course), not how they currently are... I too started off 'easy' space pinned between 2 spode loving nutjobs, both demanding ridiculous amount of cash, of which I didn't even have enough to decide which empire to piss off, I had to tell both I don't have the money... this led to them both attacking, so between those 2 empires attacking and pirates I had a good long fight on my hands where, for a time, I couldn't leave the atmosphere of my homeworld without another assault beginning... Now I am a very powerful empire that has two central locations (connected through a wormhole) and eradicate spode empires for vengeance on what those 2 original races did to me.
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Offline fiddler

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #65 on: September 17, 2008, 03:21:15 pm »
yesterday, i got my third creature to space. and just so ya know, they are Zealots. i was very curious to see who my neighbors would be because up to that point, my previous 2 creatures had it pretty easy in space. well this time things went differently. on my first mission out of my solar system, i made contact with an alien race. they didn't like me, but were not completely hostile, so i decided to do a mission for 'em. my new "friends" were a race of Covenant... the ones from the Halo series who sat in the giant hover chairs.

the mission brought me into contact with another alien race, who declared war on me for entering their space, or blowing up their turrets, i don't remember. after i completed the quest, i was attacked by the new race i had pissed off. while i was back home defending myself, the Covenant declared war on me as well. allies, maybe. the two aliens were kicking the ever livin crap out of me, and then i remembered, zealots have an ability that instantly converts an entire planet over to your side...

that may have been a bad idea. apparently there is some kind of Galactic Code and mass converting an entire homeworld is really looked down on. in my defense, i randomly picked a planet. when i realized it was a homeworld, though, i said the heck with it, i'm already here. as soon as i did it, in between and during my laughing, i was contacted by 5-6 other alien races i didn't even know were there. every one of them declared war on me for breaking a law i wasn't aware of.

it has been a very hard road, but i'm happy to say that i am slowly annihilating every single one of them. i can't really earn any money quickly because all but two alien races want me wiped off the galactic map. no money for colonies because the money i do earn goes towards upgrading my weapons.

it's hard, but i am having fun. while not intentional, i am actually glad they all hate me. my race crawled out of the primordial ooze and into fairly chaotic space. in order to survive their harsh surroundings, they have had to do horrible things. entire solar systems have been wiped clean of life. they have committed genocide on an unprecedented level, but it wasn't a fight they started. it is a fight, however, they intend to win even if they become monsters in the progress.

i can understand wanting to play a peaceful civilization, but as some have already said, being peaceful doesn't mean you can't defend yourself. instead of sittin back getting your butt kicked, i suggest strapping some bombs on your UFO and nuking some enemy colonies. ignore your own for a while, they can go a few minutes without you, as the enemy fleets usually just fly around your planets aimlessly till you show up.

after you've taken over a few colonies, or destroyed them, those who declared war on ya usually back off a little.

Offline Darcie

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #66 on: September 17, 2008, 03:33:53 pm »
I think it might just be that when you transition to space from civ mode the difficulty level gets messed up, because when I play space solo style the levels seem proper.

In general though, make friends with spode and force groups asap because they are the ones that seem to require tribute if you aren't.

Offline beta592

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #67 on: September 17, 2008, 03:43:01 pm »
I started Space stage with trepidation after hearing all the bad stories. Fortunately my game isn't 'broken'. I'm playing on hard mode as a social herbivore. I kept track of this to see what my game would be like in comparison to others, but during my first 7 hours of playing in Space, I had 5 pirate attacks and 6 ecodisasters. I do have the pirates-be-gone trait. Since that initial time, I still have very low frequency of pirate attacks and eco disasters compared to others. I guess I was lucky because my four neighbors were all social or traders as well so we got along great and eventually made alliances. Since they are peaceful they don't declare war on others and so far no one has bothered them. I encountered two hostile races, that began as neutral. In both cases I didn't have the money to please them but I did missions for one and traded and he became friendly. The other I accidentally ignored and he declared war on me.

I seem to suck at combat, it is way to hyped up for me. I can't even tell what I am shooting at with all the explosions. Fortunately, I ask my allies to fight for me and they do a great job. They have mostly conquered my enemy.

Recently I encountered a third hostile race and I immediately threw gifted money, wich raised the happiness and then traded and did a couple of missions. After that I pretty much had him neutralized as a threat. However, I never do missions that ask to attack other races. I've also not explored all that much outside my allies' territory until I got my economy rolling. I think this has prevented alot of trouble since I'm not pestered by races that I haven't met.

It is strange but my experience is nearly the opposite of many people. 

I agree with Darcie

Offline jhalderman

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Re: Space stage IS broken.
« Reply #68 on: September 18, 2008, 07:12:50 am »
Hi Everyone,

Let me just start by saying I'm a long time reader and a first time poster, so take it easy if I say something stupid ;)

Anyway I thought I should chime in here, I recently brought a new race from cell to space and was shocked to find myself in a similar situation as the op. Now what I have found is that in any case except for the worst of relations you can still do missions for the aggressive race. I've found if you accept a mission from a race with an orange status they will immediately become yellow and cease to attack you. I've also found if you do a couple missions for an aggressive race you can offset any future anger about rejecting their demands for money. I was able to ignore all of their requests until I had built my space ship up enough to take them out (I find the constant nagging for money really irritating).

Well thats my 2 cents.